[Official] Germany Revamp

[iancanton]

i've had time to have a quick look at baden-württemberg and rheinhessen and i think the following four changes are logical:

replace purple munchen by stuttgart (there are two munchens just now!);
replace pforzheim (town) by karlsruhe (city);
replace kassel (city) by dortmund (one of germany's largest cities);
replace fulda (town) by kassel (city).

do our german members agree?

i also notice that the east german river (blue impassable) still needs to be replaced by mountains (brown impassable).

ian.

[pepperonibread]

i've had time to have a quick look at baden-württemberg and rheinhessen and i think the following four changes are logical:

replace purple munchen by stuttgart (there are two munchens just now!);
replace pforzheim (town) by karlsruhe (city);
replace kassel (city) by dortmund (one of germany's largest cities);
replace fulda (town) by kassel (city).

do our german members agree?

i also notice that the east german river (blue impassable) still needs to be replaced by mountains (brown impassable).

ian.

Sounds good... I've no idea how that 2nd Munchen got there

[pepperonibread]

Ok. I updated my earlier post with ian's suggestions. I'll post in the German forum and see if I can get some input from there.

[wicked]

Are you kidding me??? The colors on that are horrid. Put down the crayons! Seriously, the coloring on the Germany map is great, I love it, don't f*ck it up with those absurd bright colors! Please no!

Also, the text looks horrible!! I don't even know where to start to suggest changes.

Ok, apparently there are two drafts? WTF? which one are you working on dude? It's impossible to comment!! Scrap whatever crap is on this page and go back to the other draft and let's comment on that, eh?

[pepperonibread]

Are you kidding me??? The colors on that are horrid. Put down the crayons! Seriously, the coloring on the Germany map is great, I love it, don't f*ck it up with those absurd bright colors! Please no!

Also, the text looks horrible!! I don't even know where to start to suggest changes.

Ok, apparently there are two drafts? WTF? which one are you working on dude? It's impossible to comment!! Scrap whatever crap is on this page and go back to the other draft and let's comment on that, eh?

Sorry about the confusion. I mostly need comments on accuracy right now, as our German members aren't satisfied with my original map (http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w108 ... ny000L.jpg). Because of the major changes, I put up a draft with more accurate borders, as I want to get the borders/country names down before redoing the good graphics version.
I'll clarify this on the 1st post

[gimil]

Condeme thy with little faith in pep's abilities

[wicked]

Oh so we shouldn't comment, rather just "trust" the mapmakers to make a good map? lol sure would be a quicker process.

Anyway, thanks for the clarification pepper. Probably best not the put "draft" on the map though, as someone just seeing the thread would think that's the real map, like I did. Maybe "THIS IS NOT THE REAL DRAFT" or something like that. I'll wait to comment on the real draft whenever you're done with the Germans. I still think the Disney colors on the real draft are a bit much.

[gimil]

Oh so we shouldn't comment, rather just "trust" the mapmakers to make a good map? lol sure would be a quicker process.

I don't believe I said that . . .

[tenio]

Can you explain why there are to copies of the map?

the one on the photobucket looks great, why do you have this one drawn in paint or something?

[pepperonibread]

Can you explain why there are to copies of the map?

the one on the photobucket looks great, why do you have this one drawn in paint or something?

I need to change the shape of the borders somewhat, so they will better reflect the borders of the actual german states. I'm getting feedback on that now. This won't affect the gameplay at all, but once these borders are decided on, I'll apply them to the better graphics version on photobucket

[tenio]

okay, now i understand,

[Zlorfik]

Sounds (and looks) passable, however you've got work to do. Might I ask why is Prussia, a German region divided between Russia and Poland currently, marked as northern Germany? And why is 50% of Rhineland not even near the Rhine river?

[Arachnophobia]

some suggestions:
The mountains in bavaria - replace them with river and try to put it a lil more north. That would be awesome for realism (and wouldnt change gameplay).
Visually extend Braunschweig til the river and shorten Bremen.
Rename Neubrandenburg to Vorpommern. Better name imo. Rename Schwerin to Mecklemburg

some things that would affect gameplay:
- add Magdeburg and Halle to prussia continent and Kiel and Hamburg to Niedersachsen-Anhalt. Add a bridge between Hamburg and Bremen. Rename Niedersachen-Anhalt to North Germany and Prussia to East Germany. Maybe you can put Hamburg ON the river and kill a bit of Bremen for that.
- Shorten Schwerin in the south. Extend Potsdam to were Schwerin was. Revamp the whole Potsdam Berlin to something like this: Berlin gets an autodeploy for 1 army and is surrounded by Brandenburg (old Potsdam) or by Potsdam in West and a new territory, Cottbus in east.
- kill the northeastern part of Erfurt for more territory of Leipzig (Halle-Leipzig are REALLY close to eachother in reality and that should be represented).
- to make East Germany less easily defended, shorten the river left of magdeburg to create a new frontier

Thats it for now, south and western germany come next when I got more time :p

[pepperonibread]

some suggestions:
The mountains in bavaria - replace them with river and try to put it a lil more north. That would be awesome for realism (and wouldnt change gameplay).
Visually extend Braunschweig til the river and shorten Bremen.
Rename Neubrandenburg to Vorpommern. Better name imo. Rename Schwerin to Mecklemburg

some things that would affect gameplay:
- add Magdeburg and Halle to prussia continent and Kiel and Hamburg to Niedersachsen-Anhalt. Add a bridge between Hamburg and Bremen. Rename Niedersachen-Anhalt to North Germany and Prussia to East Germany. Maybe you can put Hamburg ON the river and kill a bit of Bremen for that.
- Shorten Schwerin in the south. Extend Potsdam to were Schwerin was. Revamp the whole Potsdam Berlin to something like this: Berlin gets an autodeploy for 1 army and is surrounded by Brandenburg (old Potsdam) or by Potsdam in West and a new territory, Cottbus in east.
- kill the northeastern part of Erfurt for more territory of Leipzig (Halle-Leipzig are REALLY close to eachother in reality and that should be represented).
- to make East Germany less easily defended, shorten the river left of magdeburg to create a new frontier

Thats it for now, south and western germany come next when I got more time :p

Cool, thanks! I've been hoping for some good suggestions like this. I won't be able to do the gameplay changes because a revamp doesn't allow it, but everything else can be fixed

[pepperonibread]

Alright, updated the image with Arachnophobia's changes:



Also, just to clarify:

Like it was suggested, the "continents" now all align with the state borders of Germany. But because the borders were changed so much (the shape of the borders only, no gameplay changes), I needed to change the names of some of the territories. This is what I'd like comments on (from Germans, if possible). I need as accurate names as possible. Once all this stuff is ironed out, I'll begin working on applying these changes to the "graphically enhanced" version.
Also, no umlauts yet, so don't mind that.

[Splash_x]

I don't know if its just me.. but the font for the title and the authors... are a bit werid... maybe put them elsewhere? or make it seem like its not going from BIGGER tooooooooooooo smaller

[pepperonibread]

I don't know if its just me.. but the font for the title and the authors... are a bit werid... maybe put them elsewhere? or make it seem like its not going from BIGGER tooooooooooooo smaller

Ok, I'll see what I can do. I'm gonna rework the map anyway after i get the borders set in stone, so I'll be moving some things around.

[Arachnophobia]

second part of my comment :p

dont forget the river in bayern. Thats the danube, one of europes biggest rivers . The danube river exits germany right below of the passau text. Maybe you can rearrange the stuff so it looks like it :p
Kassel -> Frankfurt
Frankfurt -> Pfalz

extend the new pfalz a bit westwards, shorten the koblenz-region (as to create a border between Trier and the new Pfalz region) and put a mountain range between trier and Pfalz (doesnt affect gameplay that way . The mountain range should extend north-east-east to south-west-west (alternative if you include bridges, and have the rhine go all the way through germany, make it a river).

Try to make the new frankfurt region look less sausage like by cutting off a bit of Dortmund
http://www.wandkarten.cc/at/components/com_virtuemart/shop_image/product/230ecf0338278a579225c39418d3b5cf.jpg
Look at the position of the new frankfurt region and you should see a state. Try to make the Frankfurt region look a bit more like the southern part of that state. That would be awesome

I still really dislike the mountain range north of dresden. Here's a possible solution:
Use bridges to connect territories over rivers (that way you can also put in the rhine and danube river almost completely...). Extend the northern river along the prussia/Niedersachsen-Anhalt borderlines til you get to the mountain range. Extend it southern along the leipzig/dresden border til it exits the map :p. Replace the mountain range with a river that flows into the new long river.on the eastern most site, find a solution to make it not go into poland but also no connection between berlin and dresden.

names in bayern (bavaria):
Nuremberg -> Augsburg
Regensburg -> Nuremberg
Try to extend the new Nuremberg northwards into the Bayreuth region to actually include the city Nuremberg (that tail of bayreuth needs to go :p )

München -> Ulm
Ulm -> Tübingen
Rosenheim -> München, extend the new München region westwards. Extend the new Ulm region northwards.
Bayreuth -> Franken

The river that makes the border for Rheinhessen and Niedersachsen-Anhalt, make the part of it between Münster (change it from Munster :p ) and Göttingen, Osnabrück into a mountain range. Thats the "Teutoburger Wald ). Extend the first border part river into Münster etc so you got the rhine (if you create bridges, you can extend it further to the south etc. Extend Düsseldorf to the river (no gameplay change) to create a shorter Münster and a place for the rhine river or so.

Thats it for now. Make a new scetch

[pepperonibread]

Hey Arachnophobia, most of your suggestions look great, though keep in mind I can't make any gameplay changes. But I'll be on vacation til around Sunday, so I won't be able to make your changes until after that.

[Arachnophobia]

I made a quick edit for you to visualize my ideas :p



PS: no gameplay changes, those grey arches are bridges that connect across water

[Ogrecrusher]

3 comments to add to the above map.
Missing bridges:
Mechlemburg <-> Halle
Köln <-> Koblenz
Missing Connection:
Passau <-> Landshut

As far as I can see, these are the only issues.

[Arachnophobia]

3 comments to add to the above map.
Missing bridges:
Mechlemburg <-> Halle
Köln <-> Koblenz
Missing Connection:
Passau <-> Landshut

As far as I can see, these are the only issues.

Updated the image. Added the missing bridges and changed the territories in bavaria again (also made the danube river more realisticly in place while I was at it :p
I also renamed the Landshut region to Regensburg, the old Regensburg to Bayreuth and the old Bayreuth to Coburg, as Landshut is actually south of the danube river. Also corrected some names (Dusseldorf -> Düsseldorf, Nurnberg -> Nürnberg) and renamed Mecklenburg and Vorpommern again to fit into the city theme of all other regions (renamed Mecklenburg to Schwerin and Vorpommern to Rostock, also changed the borders a bit so that Rostock is included into that region (just because Rostock is probably the biggest city around there with lots of history and a first lvl football club :p, needed to include that one). Last change was renaming Koblenz to Siegen as Koblenz is on the western shore of the rhine river so it didnt quite match it.

Something to change in official map: move the rhine river more westwards through the Rheinhessen region to make it more realistic

[Ogrecrusher]

Nice work! Let's see what the graphics master can do with that!

[t-o-m]

i like the map, but im not too keen on the pictures in the conts. i like the pics outside them, but just find it confusing and distracting where they ar in the conts

--tom

[Arachnophobia]

Before change (numbered the countries of Niedersachsen-Anhalt)


After change


I corrected the continents "Niedersachsen-Anhalt" and "Preussen" so that they resemble more of a historic and cultural unity. Niedersachsen-Anhalt -> Norddeutschland and Preussen could stay that name. As you can look up with the numbering of the green territories, there are no gameplay changes . I had to introduce a new river though, the "Weser", which should have been included anyways (like 4th longest river in germany...). I also added a new territory "Rügen", which was not previously on the map. Its germany's biggest island and only a lil offshore from the rostock territory. Ofc the territories are rather scetchy and unnamed yet, they definately need to be reshaped a bit better and get some good names, but I dont want to do that with this scetch yet. Need opinions first ^^