when will clans be able to make in-clan tourney style games?

[hwhrhett]

over a year ago the mods took away the ability for clan tourney directors to make tourney games, games that are labeled, and more importantly games that you can make without joining them. for clan wars and clan tourneys of course. at the time we were told that we would have an even better system under the new forum program that got installed many months ago. i think we have all waited patiently for this, while many many many updates have been done. is this an update that is seen as un-neccessary? i thought it was supposed to already be a part of the new forum program thingie. is this in the works? is this hard to do? whats the hold up?

are all the other clans pleased with the way it is right now? its certainly not impossible to run a clan-tourney or challenge, but it certainly isnt easy.

[Nikolai]

They still haven't implemented that? Holy crap. And after all that bull from AK, too.

[hulmey]

And my dear friend they never will

[cena-rules]

they want to

[jiminski]

over a year ago the mods took away the ability for clan tourney directors to make tourney games, games that are labeled, and more importantly games that you can make without joining them. for clan wars and clan tourneys of course. at the time we were told that we would have an even better system under the new forum program that got installed many months ago. i think we have all waited patiently for this, while many many many updates have been done. is this an update that is seen as un-neccessary? i thought it was supposed to already be a part of the new forum program thingie. is this in the works? is this hard to do? whats the hold up?

are all the other clans pleased with the way it is right now? its certainly not impossible to run a clan-tourney or challenge, but it certainly isnt easy.

yeap! bring it in, what's the holdup?

[lancehoch]

It is in the works. I am not sure exactly when or with which round of updates, but I believe it to be about two rounds out.

EDIT: Removed PM requests for a certain person.

[Night Strike]

Gee, thanks lance.

I guess I'll just post here so I don't get a ton of PMs. The Rivals system is/was being designed for phpbb3.0, but I STILL don't think it has been released (ask Twill about that). Instead, CC is eventually going to design their own system. There is an ad-hoc group, but that effort stalled out a while back because lack had to put other things as a higher priority on his coding list. As of right now, there are a couple projects in the works that will help clans. The first is a new project that I cannot disclose (but I'm hoping gets announced soon). The second is a tournament update that is slated for lack's to-do list soon. This will be the first step to CC's own clan system, but that is still a way down the road.

[Twill]

wow, 3 mods in a row

NS asked me to clarify some things with the tournament stuff.

• Rivals turned out to be something that was going to be more work to hack to our own purposes than we thought and so we abandoned it as a tournament system (although we may still borrow some of the ladder code)
• We're currently running at something silly like 40 new tournaments a month. If we added clan tournaments to that the TDs would be so overloaded that the quality of work they do would ultimately degrade and affect the rest of the tournaments going on.
• Clans and clan-based tournaments are something that we definitely see as being core to CC's future and are really excited about some of the things we have planned.
• The big "when" question: there are some back end changes that are going in now that will be a fairly large project but are needed to keep CC multi free, de-trolled and moving forward in the big picture of feature development, and to set the stage for exciting things to come. This means you wont see a whole lot change on the front end for a little while, but rather hidden back end projects I've been asking for for about a year now (Lack keeps pushing my projects aside for "community requests". pffft. it's my turn now! )
• The big "but you didn't say when" question: it's the next thing on the list after the back end changes. that could be a week, a month, 2 months, 5 more years. I honestly just don't know. It depends on how tangled the backend web is and how challenging my requests are. Yes, blame me

We're going to be adding small things soon that will set the stage for the formal tools, and need to happen in the bigger picture, but none of them will be earth shattering on their own. together though, they should build a system where challenges are formal, publicized, meaningful and easy for everyone to initiate and run and where clans begin to take a much much more central role in the CC world.

yeah yeah, bla bla, it's all words until ya do something.

yup, it is. but then, all this was just words at some point. we only have so many resources and so much Lackattack. some things need to happen first and some things are just plain easier to make happen so they happen sooner.

Clans and clan wars are very central to the CC plan (an oxymoron I know, but there it is none the less) so the tools to support them will come, hopefully sooner rather than later.

Twill

[owenshooter]

i'm just happy to see twill is back out of the witness protection plan...-0

[hwhrhett]

cool, good to hear that yall are working on it. i hope its soon, sounds fun.

[hulmey]

i'm just happy to see twill is back out of the witness protection plan...-0

[whitestazn88]

i'm not totally worried... i just played an in-clan tournament game with another free player... it was 1v1... he's from GB, I"m from the US.... its not like it took us 3 weeks to coordinate when to play at the same time....

[hulmey]

i'm not totally worried... i just played an in-clan tournament game with another free player... it was 1v1... he's from GB, I"m from the US.... its not like it took us 3 weeks to coordinate when to play at the same time....

i think you ve missed the point!

[hwhrhett]

i'm not totally worried... i just played an in-clan tournament game with another free player... it was 1v1... he's from GB, I"m from the US.... its not like it took us 3 weeks to coordinate when to play at the same time....

imagine trying to organize a clan tourney or challenge that involves a hundred games between members of different clans. makes things much more difficult. it can work when all clan members have all their shit together, but there are very few clans that are reliable enough to get all their shit together that way, organizing 40 people to make their own games can be a challenge even for clans that do have their shit together.

[Timminz]

We're currently running at something silly like 40 new tournaments a month. If we added clan tournaments to that the TDs would be so overloaded that the quality of work they do would ultimately degrade and affect the rest of the tournaments going on.

Why not just let each clan pick a member (or 2, or 3) to have "permanent" tourney privileges? It wouldn't put any extra strain on the directors, while providing clans with the ability to create "tournament" games, for their challenges, and even their in-clan games/tourneys.

The big "when" question: there are some back end changes that are going in now that will be a fairly large project but are needed to keep CC multi free, de-trolled and moving forward in the big picture of feature development, and to set the stage for exciting things to come.

Re: Bolded part
I can understand why CC would want that, but it has nothing to do with the game itself, and therefore (in my opinion), should be of a lower priority. Spend the time and effort pleasing the majority (people who play the games), before trying to please the minority (we forum visitors).

[Gozar]

Another wonderful idea that will never see the light of day.

[hwhrhett]

Another wonderful idea that will never see the light of day.

it already saw the light of day, before thats how it worked, when someone inside of a clan made a public tourney, they were seen as contributing value to the website, and were allowed to sparingly use the privileges for in-clan things. it wasnt that everybody got clan privileges. unfortunately, this was seen as abused since a small amount(maybe a large amount im not really that certain) of freemium clans were using the privileges in order for freemiums to be able to make private games.

[Gozar]

Another wonderful idea that will never see the light of day.

it already saw the light of day, ...

A fair point. I suppose I meant that I do not expect to see it returning again.

[Night Strike]

Gozar, it WILL see the light of day again, but in a much better format than what was used before. It's going to take a good amount of time for coding and organizing a CC-specific format, but there are some beginning steps being taken to keep the clans knowing that the site isn't forgetting about them. That's part of why I'm hosting the Olympics tournament and this new plan is getting put together (and it was being discussed prior to this thread).

[hwhrhett]

Gozar, it WILL see the light of day again, but in a much better format than what was used before. It's going to take a good amount of time for coding and organizing a CC-specific format, but there are some beginning steps being taken to keep the clans knowing that the site isn't forgetting about them. That's part of why I'm hosting the Olympics tournament and this new plan is getting put together (and it was being discussed prior to this thread).

kudos on the olympics tourney btw, seems to be going swimmingly.


but i hope that theyve been thinking about it for over a year, because thats when we were told that we would have the powers back before christmas, and that we shouldnt worry about doing without them for only a matter of months.

[Night Strike]

but i hope that theyve been thinking about it for over a year, because thats when we were told that we would have the powers back before christmas, and that we shouldnt worry about doing without them for only a matter of months.

Well as Twill said, Rivals wasn't ready when they installed the new forum, and then it turned out to not be worth modifying into a CC system. This means that lack has to code it all. Everyone is clamoring for lack's time, but he's only one turtle.

[jiminski]

Gozar, it WILL see the light of day again, but in a much better format than what was used before. It's going to take a good amount of time for coding and organizing a CC-specific format, but there are some beginning steps being taken to keep the clans knowing that the site isn't forgetting about them. That's part of why I'm hosting the Olympics tournament and this new plan is getting put together (and it was being discussed prior to this thread).

kudos on the olympics tourney btw, seems to be going swimmingly.


but i hope that theyve been thinking about it for over a year, because thats when we were told that we would have the powers back before christmas, and that we shouldnt worry about doing without them for only a matter of months.

yeah i know we are a bunch of moaning old women with too much time on our hands Night Strike.. hahah but if we were not, the site would not have our custom after-all

The problem is with a site such as this (best site in the world by a country mile by the way!), where people are invited to partake in aspects of site improvement. We feel part of it but we have no real ability to exact change.
Map making and certain graft-ons which are extraneous to the basic system are absolutely fundamental to its success but for the rest of us, all we do is endlessly waffle impotently! (ok i will speak for myself) All I do is waffle impotently!

We advise ways to improve things, fine-tune them in the theatre of self-important debate. All without any real idea of the implications of change and importantly, never to the background of reports upon their progression.
We get vagaries regarding time frame: 'Working on it but the coding takes time' and 'i am seriously considering!' But it is much like the maxim "your cheque is in the post!" and "i won't come in your mouth!" .. all very comforting in the moment but after the forth time one becomes a little wary!

So forgive us if we appear impatient but it is because we feel, deludedly, part of the process and it is because we want everything.. and quicker please.


By way of another suggestion (sheese everyone is an expert!) maybe some genuine progress reports would be a good idea on certain things .. there are things on Lacks To-Do list which have been there for a couple of years.
Don't misunderstand me, the work on this site is extraordinary and great value for Dollar.. but more information can not hurt and perhaps people would understand prioritisation a little better?

I know that sounds pompous and demanding and unreasonable but hey! what the hell!.. let's all shoot for the stars!