Page 1 of 3
So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:11 amby tzor
Apart from mislabeling (and if you think that is bad I read that mislabeling fish in the United States is massive even as far as high end Sushi restaurants) what is the problem with horse meat?
I can see a problem in the United States, but that is the supply problem; race horses that have outlived their usefulness are being illegally shipped in shoddy conditions across the border to Mexico. But the problem is the conditions and treatment of these animals not the nature of the meat itself. Are similar problems happening in Europe as well?
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:15 amby crispybits
There are issues with the fact that horses, being non-meat animals in the countries with the big scandals, are allowed to be given certain medicinal substances that can persist into their meat after death and potentially cause harm to humans.
I don't remember the details tho, it was a passing comment in an article I'd read that I'd need to rack my brain even to maybe find with google.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:21 amby koontz1973
Spot on crispybits. But horse meat is not bad and is actually nice when made into sausages or even smoked and made into salami. Just not sure I really want a leg for the Sunday roast.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:31 amby jonesthecurl
I eat horse, and deliberately. That aspect wouldn't be an issue for me - but it is for many. More disturbing is the mis-labelling, and and much more disturbing than that is the corruption and the unknown sourcing of the meat. Here's a very good summary, albeit events have moved on since this. My favourite bit is the name of the Dutch company, which is "horse" spelled backwards.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/feb/15/horsemeat-scandal-the-essential-guide
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:47 amby tzor
crispybits wrote:There are issues with the fact that horses, being non-meat animals in the countries with the big scandals, are allowed to be given certain medicinal substances that can persist into their meat after death and potentially cause harm to humans.
Ah, so it's a "quality" issue. Yes, I can definitely see the problem there. So it's not really "horse" meat that is the problem; but unregulated meat from animals who have been given substances that contaminate the future meat from the animal. That makes sense.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:05 pmby Chewie1
Already been said in this thread that its the mis labelling ... in theory there is nothing wrong with eating horses after all us humans are top of the food chain.
I believe tho that there is a potential problem with a drug called bute (not sure of the spelling) that horses have been injected with by vets that may do us harm.
Other than that feed us some horse steak..... I've ate camel steak and it was very tasty.
Posted:
Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:10 pmby 2dimes
It's not a quality issue it's an issue of not being able to choose what ingredients including hormones you wish to eat.
Just because the hormone was deemed (by humans not the horse) to either not be harmful to or be more helpful than harmful.
If you're feeding it to me while labeling it something else that used to be unacceptable.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 4:22 amby smegal69
why do they use it? because Horse meat is cheaper than the meat they are saying it is....... so they want to make more money
crispybits wrote:There are issues with the fact that horses, being non-meat animals in the countries with the big scandals, are allowed to be given certain medicinal substances that can persist into their meat after death and potentially cause harm to humans.
I don't remember the details tho, it was a passing comment in an article I'd read that I'd need to rack my brain even to maybe find with google.
The amount of the drug in the horse meat is that low, you will have to eat the whole horse and then some more
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 4:34 amby xeno
I don't notice much of a difference between cow and horse anyway. I prefer buffalo, tuna, and deer steaks anyway
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:58 amby AAFitz
I prefer my broccoli, kale and spinach blended up with a banana or a mandarin.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:00 amby tzor
smegal69 wrote:The amount of the drug in the horse meat is that low, you will have to eat the whole horse and then some more
This may be true, but I can see some people freaking out over this never the less.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:03 amby tzor
xeno wrote:I don't notice much of a difference between cow and horse anyway. I prefer buffalo, tuna, and deer steaks anyway
You would love the North Fork of Long Island, we have a local restaurant in Riverhead that raises bison locally. Once a year they get to import elk.
And the deer grow like crazy here.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:20 amby puppydog85
smegal69 wrote:why do they use it? because Horse meat is cheaper than the meat they are saying it is....... so they want to make more money
crispybits wrote:There are issues with the fact that horses, being non-meat animals in the countries with the big scandals, are allowed to be given certain medicinal substances that can persist into their meat after death and potentially cause harm to humans.
I don't remember the details tho, it was a passing comment in an article I'd read that I'd need to rack my brain even to maybe find with google.
The amount of the drug in the horse meat is that low, you will have to eat the whole horse and then some more
That may be, but that should be our choice to make.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 12:00 pmby Lil_SlimShady
AAFitz wrote:I prefer my broccoli, kale and spinach blended up with a banana or a mandarin.
Found the Vegan =)
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 3:43 pmby Lootifer
Two main issues
- Saying something is beef when it is horse meat is false advertising
- The fact they are using horse meat and calling it beef implicitly means they are bypassing (or ignoring) all the health and safety regulations that apply to beef therefore health and safety is being jeopardized
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 3:52 pmby Army of GOD
I prefer saxitoxin's poop on my chest
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 4:54 pmby stahrgazer
tzor wrote:smegal69 wrote:The amount of the drug in the horse meat is that low, you will have to eat the whole horse and then some more
This may be true, but I can see some people freaking out over this never the less.
Yeah, well, scientists used to think DDT didn't matter because its quantities were low; same with mercury; and other substances; that now they realize is not only toxic to humans in "great" quantity, but does not dissipate so the quantities, and thus the effects, are cumulative.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 5:43 pmby AAFitz
stahrgazer wrote:tzor wrote:smegal69 wrote:The amount of the drug in the horse meat is that low, you will have to eat the whole horse and then some more
This may be true, but I can see some people freaking out over this never the less.
Yeah, well, scientists used to think DDT didn't matter because its quantities were low; same with mercury; and other substances; that now they realize is not only toxic to humans in "great" quantity, but does not dissipate so the quantities, and thus the effects, are cumulative.
Lead is the one you really mean here, I think.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:04 pmby BigBallinStalin
tzor wrote:Apart from mislabeling (and if you think that is bad I read that mislabeling fish in the United States is massive even as far as high end Sushi restaurants) what is the problem with horse meat?
I can see a problem in the United States, but that is the supply problem; race horses that have outlived their usefulness are being illegally shipped in shoddy conditions across the border to Mexico. But the problem is the conditions and treatment of these animals not the nature of the meat itself. Are similar problems happening in Europe as well?
wat?
In the US, you can legally cut up horses and sell their meat elsewhere.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:41 pmby jonesthecurl
Lootifer wrote:Two main issues
- Saying something is beef when it is horse meat is false advertising
- The fact they are using horse meat and calling it beef implicitly means they are bypassing (or ignoring) all the health and safety regulations that apply to beef therefore health and safety is being jeopardized
That's right: also, this is not a case of Tesco, Taco Bell, ikea etc trying to mis-sell horsemeat to the public. This is fraud against them by the suppliers. What chance does a normal citizen stand if these giants can be so easily fooled?
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:21 amby BigBallinStalin
jonesthecurl wrote:Lootifer wrote:Two main issues
- Saying something is beef when it is horse meat is false advertising
- The fact they are using horse meat and calling it beef implicitly means they are bypassing (or ignoring) all the health and safety regulations that apply to beef therefore health and safety is being jeopardized
That's right: also, this is not a case of Tesco, Taco Bell, ikea etc trying to mis-sell horsemeat to the public. This is fraud against them by the suppliers. What chance does a normal citizen stand if these giants can be so easily fooled?
Um, didn't we just discover this? There's our 'normal citizen' chances. The fraud was revealed.
Then, how do you think these companies' products will fare on the market--compared to their competitors' products which had no horse meat? People are generally free to react accordingly. X-amount of them will seek the products of companies which didn't have horse meat--or maybe they'll continue to buy the same old, same old for various, rational reasons.
I don't see why you're so concerned here.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:22 amby tzor
BigBallinStalin wrote:In the US, you can legally cut up horses and sell their meat elsewhere.
U.S. officials: No horse meat in our beefHorse meat cannot be sold for human consumption in the United States, Cochran added. "There are currently no establishments in the United States that slaughter horses, and FSIS does not allow imports of horse meat from other countries for human consumption."
I had made the mistake that I had assumed they managed to pass the export law recently; I see that they have not.
Horse meat hasn't always been illegal in the United State. Up until 2005 FSIS regularly inspected horse slaughter plants along with all other types of meat production facilities. Animal rights activists made a major push to stop the sale of horse meat and Congress added an amendment to the Agricultural Appropriations Act taking away funding for the inspection of horses being transported to slaughter.
FSIS then made horse inspection a fee-for-service inspection, just as bison still is. Congress went back and rewrote the law saying no money could be spent at "any inspection of horse slaughter," said Raymond, who at USDA at the time. By 2007 the last three American facilities that slaughtered horses for human consumption were shut down, according to a petition filed with USDA by the Humane Society in 2012.
Today American horses are still slaughtered for food, it just takes place in Mexico and Canada rather than on U.S. soil. The Government Accountability Office found that in 2010 more than 137,000 U.S. horses were sent to Mexico and Canada each year to be slaughtered. That's about as many were slaughtered in the United States before the ban went into effect in 2007, GAO said.
So in that, I stand corrected. My local vineyard also stables rescue horses.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:55 amby betiko
crispybits wrote:There are issues with the fact that horses, being non-meat animals in the countries with the big scandals, are allowed to be given certain medicinal substances that can persist into their meat after death and potentially cause harm to humans.
I don't remember the details tho, it was a passing comment in an article I'd read that I'd need to rack my brain even to maybe find with google.
Not true. France has a tradition of eating a lot of horse meat, even if that tradition is quite lost by now. When I was a kid there were tons of horse meat specialized butchers, and they have slowly almost all shut down.
We've had this scandal here last month and I am so sick and tired of the medias talking about it. I fully understand the mislabel thing and that people used this to make more profits and it's not tolerable. But it's not like if it was pork meat which isn't allowed for the 25% muslims and jews we have here, and no one got sick from eating horse.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Mon Mar 04, 2013 12:40 pmby 2dimes
BigBallinStalin wrote:jonesthecurl wrote:Lootifer wrote:Two main issues
- Saying something is beef when it is horse meat is false advertising
- The fact they are using horse meat and calling it beef implicitly means they are bypassing (or ignoring) all the health and safety regulations that apply to beef therefore health and safety is being jeopardized
That's right: also, this is not a case of Tesco, Taco Bell, ikea etc trying to mis-sell horsemeat to the public. This is fraud against them by the suppliers. What chance does a normal citizen stand if these giants can be so easily fooled?
Um, didn't we just discover this? There's our 'normal citizen' chances. The fraud was revealed.
Then, how do you think these companies' products will fare on the market--compared to their competitors' products which had no horse meat? People are generally free to react accordingly. X-amount of them will seek the products of companies which didn't have horse meat--or maybe they'll continue to buy the same old, same old for various, rational reasons.
I don't see why you're so concerned here.
In the case of Horse meat Jones and I are going to be racing back to Ikea for meatballs as soon as possible. If it were glycol not so much.
I don't have a problem with them putting potentially toxic chemicals such as nutrisweet in food. I just want clear labelling so I can make the choice of what to eat and feed my kids. If a person wants to save money and shop at walmart like most do. That's fine, personally I want to live where I can maintain the choice not to.
Re: So what's the problem with horse meat?
Posted:
Mon Mar 04, 2013 12:44 pmby thegreekdog
In Skyrim, raw horse meat restores 2 points of health. Cooked horse meat restores 10 points of health.