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US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

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US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:26 am

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Children demonstrate how to use bulletproof backpacks as shields in Aurora, Colorado. Photograph: Rick Wilking/Reuters


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/apr/26/us-bulletproof-uniforms-gun-control

Extract from the article:
The pink bulletproof rucksack that 5-year-old Jaliyah wears to school every day reaches almost down to her knees and weighs 3lbs even when empty, but for her Colorado father, the size and solidity are part of the attraction.

"If you put it on her back, it almost covers her whole body," explains Demitric Boykin. "It was a very hard conversation to have but she knows that it's something that will keep her safe."

Lined with ballistic material that can stop a 9mm bullet travelling at 400 metres per second, the backpack is only one of a clutch of new products making their way into US schools in the wake of Newtown school massacre. As gun control legislation grinds to halt in Washington, a growing number of parents and teachers are taking matters into their own hands.

The Denver company that supplied Jaliyah's rucksack, Elite Sterling Security, has sold over 300 in the last two months and received inquiries from some 2,000 families across the US. It is also in discussion with more than a dozen schools in Colorado about equipping them with ballistic safety vests, a scaled-down version of military uniforms designed to hang in classroom cupboards for children to wear in an emergency.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Woodruff on Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:34 am

Huh. That's an interesting idea. Only real problem I see is that kids' backpacks these days are already freaking heavy enough (there are serious concerns about back problems as they age). But I could certainly see this as something that some parents would want, and I have a hard time saying it's a bad idea, even with the extremely limited nature of the threat. At least they're taking a personal action for their protection that isn't impacting anyone else.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:56 am

I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby saxitoxin on Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:59 am

Symmetry wrote:I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.


Finland? (http://www.rampageshooting.com/)
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viewtopic.php?f=8&t=241668&start=200#p5349880
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Funkyterrance on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:02 pm

Symmetry wrote:I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.

In other words, Woody spoiled your troll?

My take on these is that if you hit a kid that age with a round, it's going to knock them off their feet anyway so it's only benefit is to the company selling it. The idea I'm assuming is that kids will be able to run away/block fire if they're wearing it.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:02 pm

Barry Tull, headteacher of Worcester Preparatory School in rural Maryland, has 80 ballistic shields deployed in his classrooms disguised as whiteboards and clipboards. Some teachers use them to assign homework, others lean them up against the wall, but most of Worcester's middle and high-school children know what they are for.

"Our teachers were concerned to begin with about whether they were expected to be first responders, but at least they feel they have something now as opposed to cowering in the corner with their kids," says Tull. "The former secret service trainers we had in showed us how they can deploy them; how to hold them in front of their body defensively or use them offensively where the teacher charges at someone with the shield as cover."

A spring-loaded bolt was used to show school employees what it would feel like to block a bullet with one of the shields.

The US manufacturer that supplied this equipment, Hardwire, has sold similar white boards to schools in North Dakota, Pennsylvania and California. Elite Sterling Security also sells sheets disguised as rainbow-covered posters to hang on the back of classroom doors to prevent someone trying to shoot their way in.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:03 pm

Funkyterrance wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.

In other words, Woody spoiled your troll?


How was it a troll? My first reaction when I read the article and saw the picture was exactly what I wrote.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Funkyterrance on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:06 pm

I'm not even going to dignify that with an answer.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:11 pm

Funkyterrance wrote:I'm not even going to dignify that with an answer.


I never thought you had one.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby AndyDufresne on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:27 pm

In related news, here is an example of FULL body armour, not just some flimsy backpack.

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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Funkyterrance on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:46 pm

Symmetry wrote:
Funkyterrance wrote:I'm not even going to dignify that with an answer.


I never thought you had one.


That doesn't even make sense unless you are finally admitting that half the stuff you post is done simply to get a rise out of someone, anyone, who will reply and not a legitimate desire to enter into a conversation.
Sure, you read this article and maybe you did have the reaction you stated but then again you made the effort to post it here and made sure to explicitly state that it was "US" children who get body armour. Are these going to be illegal in all other countries?
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Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:50 pm

Funkyterrance wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
Funkyterrance wrote:I'm not even going to dignify that with an answer.


I never thought you had one.


That doesn't even make sense unless you are finally admitting that half the stuff you post is done simply to get a rise out of someone, anyone, who will reply and not a legitimate desire to enter into a conversation.
Sure, you read this article and maybe you did have the reaction you stated but then again you made the effort to post it here and made sure to explicitly state that it was "US" children who get body armour. Are these going to be illegal in all other countries?


It's pretty much the title of the article dude, you should read the OP before you go off on one.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby b.k. barunt on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:52 pm

Body armor? Give the kids guns to fight back i say.


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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Army of GOD on Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:58 pm

armor*
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Re:

Postby Funkyterrance on Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:07 pm

Symmetry wrote:It's pretty much the title of the article dude, you should read the OP before you go off on one.

Yeah and whoever wrote the article was trolling too. It's got a really icky tone to it like the US is some sort of specimen to be looked at down one's nose or gawked at like a curiosity. Not to mention it's just so incredibly flimsy. You should just read the tabloids sym, you'd get more bang for your buck.

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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Maugena on Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:15 pm

XD @ B.K.
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Re: Re:

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 1:19 pm

Funkyterrance wrote:
Symmetry wrote:It's pretty much the title of the article dude, you should read the OP before you go off on one.

Yeah and whoever wrote the article was trolling too. It's got a really icky tone to it like the US is some sort of specimen to be looked at down one's nose or gawked at like a curiosity.


Perhaps reading and commenting on some other article would calm you down. I recommend perusing this one:

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=97257

I should warn you though, it's also one of mine.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby BigBallinStalin on Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:13 pm

Symmetry wrote:I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.


They're not required to, and since the risk (on a national level) is extremely low, then saying "need to wear X" is a bit misleading. (Whether you're unintentionally misleading yourself or intentionally misleading others, it's difficult to say).

If anything, the story provides another outstanding example of the capabilities of the market, and the ability of people to find their own non-political solutions--without appealing to the state to take people's money to provide X (mass-supported theft would be depressing).
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Postby 2dimes on Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:18 pm

Funkyterrance wrote:It's got a really icky tone to it like the US is some sort of specimen to be looked at down one's nose or gawked at like a curiosity.

Wait, you make it sound like our trips to your country to "observe" would end in dissapointment.

You need to take a vacation somewhere with a Golden Corral. It's kind of like dinner theatre with addictive chemically inhanced food. We've seen people over 500 pounds, right there at a nearby table on every trip, it's awesome! One particularly large fellow had a buddy there acting as a sort of runner/waiter going to fetch plates piled high. We have overweight people here, I am one but not on the same scale.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby patches70 on Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:44 pm

BigBallinStalin wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.


They're not required to, and since the risk (on a national level) is extremely low, then saying "need to wear X" is a bit misleading. (Whether you're unintentionally misleading yourself or intentionally misleading others, it's difficult to say).

If anything, the story provides another outstanding example of the capabilities of the market, and the ability of people to find their own non-political solutions--without appealing to the state to take people's money to provide X (mass-supported theft would be depressing).


Absolutely. This is a great example of someone seeing a desire for a product and then producing that product for sale to those who desire said product. It's a great exchange. The producer provides a product, the purchaser gets piece of mind. Whether or not the purchaser is deluding themselves is another matter, but completely irrelevant. Both parties involved gain.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:02 pm

patches70 wrote:
BigBallinStalin wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.


They're not required to, and since the risk (on a national level) is extremely low, then saying "need to wear X" is a bit misleading. (Whether you're unintentionally misleading yourself or intentionally misleading others, it's difficult to say).

If anything, the story provides another outstanding example of the capabilities of the market, and the ability of people to find their own non-political solutions--without appealing to the state to take people's money to provide X (mass-supported theft would be depressing).


Absolutely. This is a great example of someone seeing a desire for a product and then producing that product for sale to those who desire said product. It's a great exchange. The producer provides a product, the purchaser gets piece of mind. Whether or not the purchaser is deluding themselves is another matter, but completely irrelevant. Both parties involved gain.


Ah, pretend economists. And I thought you guys were actually against gov't spending. At $375-400 each, per vest alone, it'll cost...
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby patches70 on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:11 pm

Symmetry wrote:
patches70 wrote:
BigBallinStalin wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.


They're not required to, and since the risk (on a national level) is extremely low, then saying "need to wear X" is a bit misleading. (Whether you're unintentionally misleading yourself or intentionally misleading others, it's difficult to say).

If anything, the story provides another outstanding example of the capabilities of the market, and the ability of people to find their own non-political solutions--without appealing to the state to take people's money to provide X (mass-supported theft would be depressing).


Absolutely. This is a great example of someone seeing a desire for a product and then producing that product for sale to those who desire said product. It's a great exchange. The producer provides a product, the purchaser gets piece of mind. Whether or not the purchaser is deluding themselves is another matter, but completely irrelevant. Both parties involved gain.


Ah, pretend economists. And I thought you guys were actually against gov't spending. At $375-400 each, per vest alone, it'll cost...


You aren't too bright or you don't read very well. The backpacks are produced by a private company and bought by private citizens. The US government isn't buying them. So where is the government spending you allege?

There is nothing wrong with people spending their own money on what they wish.
There is nothing wrong with people producing products that people desire. So long as no one is forced at any point.
So long as the product is lawful, and there certainly isn't anything unlawful about those backpacks.

I'd argue against the practicality of the product, but that's for each buyer to evaluate and decide for themselves. Who am I (or you for that matter) to tell someone else what they can or can't purchase with their own money so long as such transactions are lawful?

I'm not sure you even understand market principles. You might wanna work on that, or don't. It doesn't really matter either way. It is what it is.


Edit: Oh, you are probably talking about the bullet proof blackboards, right? Yeah, well, government is good at wasting money. But if, God forbid, another such shooting occurs and one of those blackboards even saves a single life, it'd be money well spent some would argue.
Last edited by patches70 on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby 2dimes on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:13 pm

Like other school supplies parents will have to buy them. Sorry poor kids.
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:26 pm

patches70 wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
patches70 wrote:
BigBallinStalin wrote:
Symmetry wrote:I guess I just find the idea of a nation where 5 year old kids need to wear bulletproof clothing kind of depressing.


They're not required to, and since the risk (on a national level) is extremely low, then saying "need to wear X" is a bit misleading. (Whether you're unintentionally misleading yourself or intentionally misleading others, it's difficult to say).

If anything, the story provides another outstanding example of the capabilities of the market, and the ability of people to find their own non-political solutions--without appealing to the state to take people's money to provide X (mass-supported theft would be depressing).


Absolutely. This is a great example of someone seeing a desire for a product and then producing that product for sale to those who desire said product. It's a great exchange. The producer provides a product, the purchaser gets piece of mind. Whether or not the purchaser is deluding themselves is another matter, but completely irrelevant. Both parties involved gain.


Ah, pretend economists. And I thought you guys were actually against gov't spending. At $375-400 each, per vest alone, it'll cost...


You aren't too bright or you don't read very well. The backpacks are produced by a private company and bought by private citizens. The US government isn't buying them. So where is the government spending you allege?

There is nothing wrong with people spending their own money on what they wish.
There is nothing wrong with people producing products that people desire. So long as no one is forced at any point.
So long as the product is lawful, and there certainly isn't anything unlawful about those backpacks.

I'd argue against the practicality of the product, but that's for each buyer to evaluate and decide for themselves. Who am I (or you for that matter) to tell someone else what they can or can't purchase with their own money so long as such transactions are lawful?

I'm not sure you even understand market principles. You might wanna work on that, or don't. It doesn't really matter either way. It is what it is.


You should consider reading the article.

I get that that's not your thing as a fake expert, and you just looked at the picture in the OP and then turned off, but no, I was not talking about the backpacks, but the vests. I should maybe have mentioned that I was costing the vests in the post you replied to...

...hey, it's right there- "At $375-400 each, per vest alone, it'll cost..."

Oh dear, Pat, your rant for nothing. Not too bright, are you? Maybe you don't read well?
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Re: US Schoolkids to get Body Armour

Postby Symmetry on Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:35 pm

Huh, he logged off.
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