Conquer Club

"Credible research has reached the shocking conclusion that every year an estimate of more than 100,000 Christians are killed because of some relation to their faith" - Vatican spokesman Archbishop Silvano Maria Tomasi.

Are Muslims murdering Christians wholesale? Is it unfeasibly dangerous to live as a Christian in the Middle East or South Asia?

Yes. Depends.

mrswdk wrote:"Credible research has reached the shocking conclusion that every year an estimate of more than 100,000 Christians are killed because of some relation to their faith" - Vatican spokesman Archbishop Silvano Maria Tomasi.

Are Muslims murdering Christians wholesale? Is it unfeasibly dangerous to live as a Christian in the Middle East or South Asia?

Not just Christians,apostates are in particular danger.

mrswdk wrote:"Credible research has reached the shocking conclusion that every year an estimate of more than 100,000 Christians are killed because of some relation to their faith" - Vatican spokesman Archbishop Silvano Maria Tomasi.

Are Muslims murdering Christians wholesale? Is it unfeasibly dangerous to live as a Christian in the Middle East or South Asia?

What was the research? As an atheist/agnostic, I tend to find what the Vatican considers "credible" to be a bit of a flexible term considering the source.

More research requested as I would consider the ratio of Muslims killed to be higher. Enlighten me OP

Hey it's time for me to high five Symm because we agree momentarily.

It's not like a person who was not born in to it can just dabble in Islam or make friendly inquiries to convert. You could get into some dire trouble just by going over there and asking questions in the wrong way to the right people.

Ever notice there is no such thing as a muslim missionary?

chang50 wrote:apostates are in particular danger.

Do you mean to try to apply the word apostate? Because there is no such thing or word in arabic and/or Islam. Though, I supose one could sort of while not understanding things, use that word to describe things such as, a murtadd, a munafiq, a kafir or in the case of someone really strict possibly even a fasi.

Non of those are my English letter translitorations so I can't warrent how close they are to whatever you're trying to say here. There are some pretty gaping cultural differences beyond the fact that the languages don't align in any manner to allow apostate to just be thrown around.

Basically a true Muslim would be completely unable to discern a Christian from an Apostate since both would be "fasi" and therefore they would need to (I'm not going to bother looking up the correct phrasing but basically convert or profess they have) in order to live. Should be no problem for an "apostate" but again there is nothing culturally like that so the word does not directly translate.

Sorry, I'll try to leave you to hapilly return to your belief that Isslam = Judaism and/or Christianity.

Looks a little like mrswdk is living in a place where that is not an option. The best part is the people in his region are probably trying to re-brand it to fit their culture. It does not work that way. They can never be fully Hallal. Therefore they can only ever be converted from "fasi" by learning Arabic, doing a "pilgrimage" to mecca, though we are probably not able to use or translate that word properly either.

Well that was a waste of 25 minutes I'm sure. Nice work sucking me into conversation here again.

2dimes wrote:Hey it's time for me to high five Symm because we agree momentarily.

It's not like a person who was not born in to it can just dabble in Islam or make friendly inquiries to convert. You could get into some dire trouble just by going over there and asking questions in the wrong way to the right people.

Ever notice there is no such thing as a muslim missionary?

chang50 wrote:apostates are in particular danger.

Do you mean to try to apply the word apostate? Because there is no such thing or word in arabic and/or Islam. Though, I supose one could sort of while not understanding things, use that word to describe things such as, a murtadd, a munafiq, a kafir or in the case of someone really strict possibly even a fasi.

Non of those are my English letter translitorations so I can't warrent how close they are to whatever you're trying to say here. There are some pretty gaping cultural differences beyond the fact that the languages don't align in any manner to allow apostate to just be thrown around.

Basically a true Muslim would be completely unable to discern a Christian from an Apostate since both would be "fasi" and therefore they would need to (I'm not going to bother looking up the correct phrasing but basically convert or profess they have) in order to live. Should be no problem for an "apostate" but again there is nothing culturally like that so the word does not directly translate.

Sorry, I'll try to leave you to hapilly return to your belief that Isslam = Judaism and/or Christianity.

Looks a little like mrswdk is living in a place where that is not an option. The best part is the people in his region are probably trying to re-brand it to fit their culture. It does not work that way. They can never be fully Hallal. Therefore they can only ever be converted from "fasi" by learning Arabic, doing a "pilgrimage" to mecca, though we are probably not able to use or translate that word properly either.

Well that was a waste of 25 minutes I'm sure. Nice work sucking me into conversation here again.

My probably incomplete understanding of apostate is that it applies to someone who leaves a religion,and in the case of Islam this can result in a death sentence.

2dimes wrote:Hey it's time for me to high five Symm because we agree momentarily.

It's not like a person who was not born in to it can just dabble in Islam or make friendly inquiries to convert. You could get into some dire trouble just by going over there and asking questions in the wrong way to the right people.

Ever notice there is no such thing as a muslim missionary?

Thanks for the high five, I'm not sure about the rest of the post though. I don't see why you think you can't make friendly inquiries into Islam.

Symmetry wrote:Thanks for the high five, I'm not sure about the rest of the post though. I don't see why you think you can't make friendly inquiries into Islam.

Of course you can't. Sort of like Chang50 said.

chang50 wrote:in the case of Islam this can result in a death sentence.

Except it becomes so complicated that no one can understand it. Including but not limited to those that might kill you.

Sort of like I always thought "no one" was one word. According to spell cheque it is two. It's a people issue and more due to a large degree of intelligence ( possibly another word/concept that could be similar yet very different) more than ignorance. Some say "Ignorance is bliss."
There is truth to that.

chang50 wrote:My probably incomplete understanding of apostate is that it applies to someone who leaves a religion,and in the case of Islam this can result in a death sentence.

Thing is you're totally correct when describing a Christian and speaking English. It's not that we're stupid. (Though in heated discussions I have read Arabs basically stating we are.)

It is more so that even though they are in many cases living in tents or other places where they need to go get water in a container and cook over a small pile of glowing coals. ( It's not coal. That would be toxic and really gross. It is charcoal and some of the most delicious food I have tasted anywhere in the world! You can't even put sauce on it because that would ruin it. And you would think sauce is always an improvement.)
They are very intelligent. If you meet a Christian/anglo living like that they might not even be able to read.

Christianity it's self can be simplified to Matthew 22:35-41. Absolutely anything else is details.

Islam on the other hand is infinitely complex, no one can understand either from another person's understanding of them.

I hate you all for ruining my persona here. I have to go purge in the longest thread or "spam a lot" or something.

mrswdk wrote:"Credible research has reached the shocking conclusion that every year an estimate of more than 100,000 Christians are killed because of some relation to their faith" - Vatican spokesman Archbishop Silvano Maria Tomasi.

Are Muslims murdering Christians wholesale? Is it unfeasibly dangerous to live as a Christian in the Middle East or South Asia?

If we are going to answer this question, perhaps we should have a look at the "credible research" in question.

Metsfanmax wrote:If we are going to answer this question, perhaps we should have a look at the "credible research" in question.

Why? I suspect you will think it is some how connected to his link and/or the source for that. Even if only by the laughable claim that they are the Christians. The reason the archbishop used the words, "credible research" is because, it's not even religious organizations recording that fact.

2dimes wrote:

Metsfanmax wrote:If we are going to answer this question, perhaps we should have a look at the "credible research" in question.

Why?

Mainly because I don't implicitly trust things I hear thirdhand on an internet forum.

Where do you go? May I come or is it a closed group?

2dimes wrote:

Symmetry wrote:Thanks for the high five, I'm not sure about the rest of the post though. I don't see why you think you can't make friendly inquiries into Islam.

Of course you can't. Sort of like Chang50 said.

chang50 wrote:in the case of Islam this can result in a death sentence.

Perhaps you could ask a Muslim friend, or a member of a local mosque. Generally they're very open about their faith, and will hardly try to kill you at all.

Symmetry wrote:

2dimes wrote:

Symmetry wrote:Thanks for the high five, I'm not sure about the rest of the post though. I don't see why you think you can't make friendly inquiries into Islam.

Of course you can't. Sort of like Chang50 said.

chang50 wrote:in the case of Islam this can result in a death sentence.

Perhaps you could ask a Muslim friend, or a member of a local mosque. Generally they're very open about their faith, and will hardly try to kill you at all.

Huh, so you did not read "the rest of the post" no wonder you're "not sure." < movie reference?

This Muslim friend, have they killed anyone?

Eh, if it's a movie reference, it's not one I picked up on. Apologies.

So Muslims will only try to kill you a little bit?

mrswdk wrote:So Muslims will only try to kill you a little bit?

Meh, you'll hardly notice it, man up dude.

100,000 people noticed it a great deal.

That's not very good advertisement for the church.
You'll be saved forever!*

*Except for your body, 100,000 of you are going to be murdered this year.

I understand why people are murdered for their money and stuff, but how can one murder someone for their faith? Are we dealing with faith bandits? And if so, how scared should we be?

mrswdk wrote:Credible research...

Still waiting for the source of this credible research.

Now you have me wondering exactly how many people are murdered annually and is this Christian purge a new form of natural selection?

100,000 is a hard number to believe without empirical evidence. In my experience of living in the Middle East and learning Arabic, Christians are safe in a Muslim society as the vast majority of people don't care if you are the Christian minority in these countries, as most people focus more on whether you don't do things that are haram (forbidden) and you go about life modestly. If you follow those social cue, you are allowed to act according to your faith without fear of persecution.

There are specific regions (Western Iraq comes to mind) where it is more dangerous to Christian, and so you get people who end up pretending to be Muslim so they evade and violence directed towards them. Islamic texts even mention that it is fine to not be Muslim as long as they live a virtuous life,treat people okay, etc. The only things that comes to mind that is explicit condemned is being pagan.

The hundred 100,000 deaths thing still seems a bit of a stretch unless the person conducting the study counts people getting kill in North Korea and China under that banner.