cba to Google an English language link right now but:
A woman in one of the parts of China (everything outside Beijing is all the same to me so I forget) recently went to court accusing a man of pushing her to the ground, demanding he pay compensation for her medical expenses. He contested that he merely happened to be nearby, saw her fall and went over to help her up, a version of events supported by witnesses. The judge, however, declared that 'common sense' says only the person who knocked her over would help her up, and the man got stuck with thousands of dollars in compensation payouts (bear in mind that the average yearly salary in Chin is still only about $8,000).
There have since been a bunch of stories about crazy old grannies trying (with varying degrees of success) to, sue concerned adults/children/whoever that helped them up, and crowds gathering round to watch old people who have fallen down in the street but no one helping them up for fear of being sued. Some 80-year guy got left face down in the street for two hours until an ambulance arrived.
I also saw a story about a girl who got knocked off her bike on a remote road in a hit-and-run accident, and in the following two hours was ignored by 30-40 passing vehicles (of which 5 ran straight over her, so we can be damn sure they knew she was there). The person who eventually called an ambulance didn't stick around to wait for it either.
It appears that now, most of the country is scared of helping anyone they see injured in case it turns around and bites them in the ass.
Just sharing my experiences of the world's stupidest country. Stay tuned!
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 1:39 pm
by Metsfanmax
mrswdk wrote:I also saw a story about a girl who got knocked off her bike on a remote road in a hit-and-run accident, and in the following two hours was ignored by 30-40 passing vehicles (of which 5 ran straight over her, so we can be damn sure they knew she was there). The person who eventually called an ambulance didn't stick around to wait for it either.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 3:15 pm
by _sabotage_
I thought they had a new law in place to deal with the problem, similar to a good samaritan act.
When they introduced the standardized penalty for deaths caused by cars a few years back, Hainan became a pedestrian ridden roadway, with people trying to get hit.
Not much different from law suits in the US, except smaller rewards. Hot Hot Hot reads McDies cups worldwide.
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 4:47 pm
by 2dimes
A law? That is the solution for people that don't know running over a child is a bad thing? Carry on.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 5:21 pm
by _sabotage_
We had a guy in New York stabbed to death like 40 times on the street in front of loads of people, who then left the body there for a day. None of this is unique to CHina.
For something unique to China: a couple were discovered killing people to boil their remains and sell the human oil (liposuction is rare in China).
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 5:34 pm
by 2dimes
Fear is different from apathy.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 7:56 pm
by john9blue
yeah, as pessimistic as i tend to be about human nature, it seems like these people WANT to help the old men/ladies up, but are scared to do so because too much power has been given to ignorant government officials.
any power will be abused.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 8:04 pm
by notyou2
Sounds to me like incompetent judges/adjudicators or whatever they are. I suspect they are appointed due to bribery etc.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 8:22 pm
by Phatscotty
Metsfanmax wrote:
mrswdk wrote:I also saw a story about a girl who got knocked off her bike on a remote road in a hit-and-run accident, and in the following two hours was ignored by 30-40 passing vehicles (of which 5 ran straight over her, so we can be damn sure they knew she was there). The person who eventually called an ambulance didn't stick around to wait for it either.
I'm not sure if the person who finally moved the mutilated child was the one who called the ambulance as well, but I heard the lady who finally acted got a cash reward from the government, to try to encourage other people to be more respectful of life.
Maybe yall could introduce a dose of Jesus? Cuz right now this is sounding similar to the emptiness in our public education system.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 8:29 pm
by notyou2
Phatscotty wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
mrswdk wrote:I also saw a story about a girl who got knocked off her bike on a remote road in a hit-and-run accident, and in the following two hours was ignored by 30-40 passing vehicles (of which 5 ran straight over her, so we can be damn sure they knew she was there). The person who eventually called an ambulance didn't stick around to wait for it either.
I'm not sure if the person who finally moved the mutilated child was the one who called the ambulance as well, but I heard the lady who finally acted got a cash reward from the government, to try to encourage other people to be more respectful of life.
Maybe yall could introduce a dose of Jesus? Cuz right now this is sounding similar to the emptiness in our public education system.
Huh??????
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 8:37 pm
by 2dimes
Ha, phatloser. Your jesus is against the law in China. Government money and legislation will solve the problem.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 9:39 pm
by notyou2
Is Jesus loving America more tolerant and compassionate than heathen China?
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:18 pm
by Metsfanmax
Phatscotty wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
mrswdk wrote:I also saw a story about a girl who got knocked off her bike on a remote road in a hit-and-run accident, and in the following two hours was ignored by 30-40 passing vehicles (of which 5 ran straight over her, so we can be damn sure they knew she was there). The person who eventually called an ambulance didn't stick around to wait for it either.
I'm not sure if the person who finally moved the mutilated child was the one who called the ambulance as well, but I heard the lady who finally acted got a cash reward from the government, to try to encourage other people to be more respectful of life.
Maybe yall could introduce a dose of Jesus? Cuz right now this is sounding similar to the emptiness in our public education system.
What happens in China sounds similar to the emptiness in our charitable donations. Billions of people in developing nations suffer from poverty, hunger and disease, and Western nations give a pittance in foreign aid and charitable donations targeted at these problems (relative to their own wealth). The people who walked by that poor girl are not substantially different from the Western nations that do very little in the face of suffering in other nations when they could do so at relatively little cost.
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:42 pm
by 2dimes
notyou2 wrote:Is Jesus loving America more tolerant and compassionate than heathen China?
Significantly. Could you drive a truck over the feet of or even merely ride a motorbike past a child that had been run over. Even people in North America that think Confucius is a greater teacher than the other guy have too much compassion in their hearts to act like those in met's video. Though we're catching up I suspect.
I would stop to help an old lady in need at the risk of having to pay her $20000 medical bill.
People in New York are afraid to help someone who has been stabbed out of fear that it is a trap and they will be robbed. Not because they think someone has tried to inconvenience them by placing a half dead child on the road.
Quoted before he tries to change his tune.
Metsfanmax wrote:What happens in China sounds similar to the emptiness in our charitable donations. Billions of people in developing nations suffer from poverty, hunger and disease, and Western nations give a pittance in foreign aid and charitable donations targeted at these problems (relative to their own wealth). The people who walked by that poor girl are not substantially different from the Western nations that do very little in the face of suffering in other nations when they could do so at relatively little cost.
Now I know you're a good person notyou2 even if you might not drop a loonie into the unicef abortion funding box. I bet if you watched that video of the kid being run over you cringed when the guy hit the gas and ran over it the second time with the back wheels, because there is a huge difference between that and not tithing to church or state.
Could westerners afford more charity and do more good? Certainly. Would it solve poverty? No, but it would be the right thing to do. Then again not doing it is a pretty far cry from that video in my opinion.
I would not be surprised if you give more money to charity than a typical "Christian" too.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:02 am
by Phatscotty
Metsfanmax wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
mrswdk wrote:I also saw a story about a girl who got knocked off her bike on a remote road in a hit-and-run accident, and in the following two hours was ignored by 30-40 passing vehicles (of which 5 ran straight over her, so we can be damn sure they knew she was there). The person who eventually called an ambulance didn't stick around to wait for it either.
I'm not sure if the person who finally moved the mutilated child was the one who called the ambulance as well, but I heard the lady who finally acted got a cash reward from the government, to try to encourage other people to be more respectful of life.
Maybe yall could introduce a dose of Jesus? Cuz right now this is sounding similar to the emptiness in our public education system.
What happens in China sounds similar to the emptiness in our charitable donations. Billions of people in developing nations suffer from poverty, hunger and disease, and Western nations give a pittance in foreign aid and charitable donations targeted at these problems (relative to their own wealth). The people who walked by that poor girl are not substantially different from the Western nations that do very little in the face of suffering in other nations when they could do so at relatively little cost.
You really think that huh. Let's go there. You send your money over to China to help the image in your head of a person laying in the dust dying of starvation, nobody cares, people walk over them as they starve. So, the money and aid that you sent, where do you think it goes first? Certainly you don't think a drone is gonna drop a plate of rice and some American dollars on top of the starving person? Because really I think that's what you want to happen and you just want to throw other people's money at the idea. But you don't pay any mind to the real world, and where that money is going to really end up. If you had some control over the Chinese government, or hung Phat owes you a personal favor, then maybe there's a chance.
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:22 am
by 2dimes
Phatscotty wrote: a drone is gonna drop a plate of rice and some American dollars on top of the starving person?
I would like to donate twenty dollars to your charity.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:32 am
by Phatscotty
I know what you mean Mets, don't get me wrong. Nobody wants people to starve anywhere, well, maybe some people want Conservatives to starve, but anyways, you send your money to Africa to help a starving person, but really you are stuffing Koni's pocket, or whichever tinpot dictator is on the top of the hill at the moment.
They just aren't going to let that money, in their perspective, be 'wasted' on an old starving person when they have soldiers risking their life who are hungry too.
Re:
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:35 am
by Phatscotty
2dimes wrote:
Phatscotty wrote: a drone is gonna drop a plate of rice and some American dollars on top of the starving person?
I would like to donate twenty dollars to your charity.
Drop it in any red bucket, and I will see to it that Chinese airspace is violated. everyone else is doing it!
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:35 am
by Metsfanmax
Phatscotty wrote:I know what you mean Mets, don't get me wrong. Nobody wants people to starve anywhere, well, maybe some people want Conservatives to starve, but anyways, you send your money to Africa to help a starving person, but really you are stuffing Koni's pocket, or whichever tinpot dictator is on the top of the hill at the moment.
They just aren't going to let that money, in their perspective, be 'wasted' on an old starving person when they have soldiers risking their life who are hungry too.
Do you actually have data to support the claim that charitable donations never actually help individuals in African nations, or are you just talking out of your ass? If you'd really like to get into this, I can provide you with a ton of links demonstrating the opposite. But I'm not convinced it's worth my time, because you'll find some sentence in one of them saying that there were a few instances where distributions went wrong and conclude that it therefore never works.
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:43 am
by 2dimes
Mocking your posts is exactly like running over a child with a van.
Twice.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:49 am
by Phatscotty
I'm pretty sure there have been individuals who have been helped by charitable donations, probably millions. Even a few dictators too. Are you really asking me for a source of African leaders who have stolen money, aid, supplies, shelters? Or is it only Republican presidents in America who do that hehe
'never' is your word. Perhaps there is no corruption at all in Africa, yes, hungry armies just let the aid land on their air strips, and they let the food pass through their hands and hand it to the weakest amongst the people, cuz you know that's how humans are, they always treat the poorest and sickest and ugliest and most hungry the nicest and make sure they are first in line! The healthy people, the one's with power and connections and people who facilitate the transfer of the money and the aid, they wait patiently in the back of the line...
...and the kings, presidents, ministers, warlords, religious leaders don't even take a cut! You want a source? Yeah, they had an African scribe right there, watching it all go down, writing every word spoken and recording every pound pilfered, so that the truth of their actions can be released for all to see! Cuz that's how humans are
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:54 am
by Metsfanmax
Phatscotty wrote:I'm pretty sure there have been individuals who have been helped by charitable donations, probably millions. Even a few dictators too. Are you really asking me for a source of African leaders who have stolen money, aid, supplies, shelters? Or is it only Republican presidents in America who do that hehe
'never' is your word. Perhaps there is no corruption at all in Africa, yes, hungry armies just let the aid land on their air strips, and they let the food pass through their hands and hand it to the weakest amongst the people (cuz you know that's how humans are, they always treat the poorest and sickest and ugliest and most hungry the nicest and make sure they are first in line!)
...and the leaders don't even take a cut! You want a source? Yeah, they had an African scribe right there, watching it all go down, writing every word spoken and recording every pound pilfered, so that the truth of their actions can be released for all to see! Cuz that's how humans are
You're using the fact that some charitable efforts may be inhibited by corrupt governments as a justification for not giving any money to charitable efforts in Africa, it seems, which is why I used 'never'. But you also have an obsolete idea of what charitable donations can mean in 2013. One of the most effective charities out there is GiveDirectly. This organization takes cash that you give them, and gives it directly to African individuals through a cell phone app, basically. There's no government involvement in that process. Would you be willing to donate to that effort?
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 1:01 am
by Phatscotty
well, to put it another way, the more stable a country is, the more infrastructure etc, the more aid will reach the intended targets, in general.
But what you said that got me involved here was about 'how simple and cheap it would be to just feed everyone in the world'.
About charity in 2013, Obama and the Democrats and the people who put them there are VERY eager to close that tax deductible charitable giving 'loophole' so naturally, a lot of starving people are not going to be receiving any aid. Our government needs that money to give everyone in America access to health insurance corporations who are in bed with the government scratching each others backs.
Noticing a pattern?
It's not a slam on charity, just a statement that actually no it's not that simple and it's not that cheap.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 1:08 am
by Metsfanmax
Phatscotty wrote:well, to put it another way, the more stable a country is, the more infrastructure etc, the more aid will reach the intended targets, in general.
So, would you support GiveDirectly, since it bypasses that and doesn't need a stable government to deliver impacts?
But what you said that got me involved here was about 'how simple and cheap it would be to just feed everyone in the world'.
I said that we collectively have a lot of wealth and developing nations have very little wealth, and we are giving very little of that to those developing nations. On an individual level, we should feel morally culpable that we're not giving more to individuals in other countries that don't have nearly as much wealth as we do. Whether or not that translates into effective foreign policy at the federal level is a different issue.
Re: Helping up injured old ladies in China
Posted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 1:14 am
by BigBallinStalin
Metsfanmax wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:I'm pretty sure there have been individuals who have been helped by charitable donations, probably millions. Even a few dictators too. Are you really asking me for a source of African leaders who have stolen money, aid, supplies, shelters? Or is it only Republican presidents in America who do that hehe
'never' is your word. Perhaps there is no corruption at all in Africa, yes, hungry armies just let the aid land on their air strips, and they let the food pass through their hands and hand it to the weakest amongst the people (cuz you know that's how humans are, they always treat the poorest and sickest and ugliest and most hungry the nicest and make sure they are first in line!)
...and the leaders don't even take a cut! You want a source? Yeah, they had an African scribe right there, watching it all go down, writing every word spoken and recording every pound pilfered, so that the truth of their actions can be released for all to see! Cuz that's how humans are
You're using the fact that some charitable efforts may be inhibited by corrupt governments as a justification for not giving any money to charitable efforts in Africa, it seems, which is why I used 'never'. But you also have an obsolete idea of what charitable donations can mean in 2013. One of the most effective charities out there is GiveDirectly. This organization takes cash that you give them, and gives it directly to African individuals through a cell phone app, basically. There's no government involvement in that process. Would you be willing to donate to that effort?
That's probably the best way.
Do you think the larger charitable organizations (who definitely have to coordinate with foreign governments) are worth the costs?
Posted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 1:35 pm