Conquer Club

I'm starting to believe it is. Argue with me why it isn't so. (btw, I have low expectations on this conversation )

Is a case of beer and a bottle of tequila on a Friday night
considered low expectations?

oVo wrote:Is a case of beer and a bottle of tequila on a Friday night
considered low expectations?

Let's say you either have the choice of fifteen different types of beer, or you had just two different types of beer you could choose from. Do you think your increase in expectations when getting to choose from fifteen types of beer would be matched by your increase in enjoyment from the beer you end up choosing? Or do you think that your expectations will become way higher than the increase in enjoyment?
Do you think you could be pleasantly surprised by the beer you chosed when you had 15 different types to choose from?

It depends on how much you complain about having so many choices.

I'm very happy with this thread.

BigBallinStalin wrote:It depends on how much you complain about having so many choices.

The more choice you have the less happy you will be with what you choose, because you will have higher expectation on what you just bought. And you are more likely to regret what you bought because you are assuming that with so many options you could probably have gotten someting better. And to top it off you will end up blaming yourself for not making a better choice. Unlike when there's a small amount to choose from, where you will blame the lack of alternatives in the store for you possible dissatisfaction.
The increase in variety can't make up for the incredibly high expectations we have when offered many choices, some choice is better than no choice, but next to unlimited amount of choice does not equal higher satisfaction but the opposite.

Gillipig wrote:

BigBallinStalin wrote:It depends on how much you complain about having so many choices.

The more choice you have the less happy you will be with what you choose, because you will have higher expectation on what you just bought. And you are more likely to regret what you bought because you are assuming that with so many options you could probably have gotten someting better. And to top it off you will end up blaming yourself for not making a better choice. Unlike when there's a small amount to choose from, where you will blame the lack of alternatives in the store for you possible dissatisfaction.
The increase in variety can't make up for the incredibly high expectations we have when offered many choices, some choice is better than no choice, but next to unlimited amount of choice does not equal higher satisfaction but the opposite.

So... there was this psychological experiment where there's two groups, and each participant is asked to make two drawings but can only have one of them. In group A, the participant gets to choose which one he gets. In group B, the Experimenter chooses which of your two drawings you get. After a couple months, they called up people in group A and found that group A people were more likely to be dissatisfied with their chosen drawing, which suggests that most people--in this context--would prefer to have no autonomy over the matter. (Of course, that implication doesn't follow for various reasons--one being that the study had something like 30 people, which is too small a sample size to generalize the results).

Maybe that's what you mean. I guess, but do you think happiness is a function of some range of choices or is happiness mostly a function of much more internal mechanisms (psychological factors)? I'd opt for the latter, so I'd be hesitant to blame the existence of more choices. You can give some people the world, and they still won't be satisfied.

BigBallinStalin wrote:

Gillipig wrote:

BigBallinStalin wrote:It depends on how much you complain about having so many choices.

The more choice you have the less happy you will be with what you choose, because you will have higher expectation on what you just bought. And you are more likely to regret what you bought because you are assuming that with so many options you could probably have gotten someting better. And to top it off you will end up blaming yourself for not making a better choice. Unlike when there's a small amount to choose from, where you will blame the lack of alternatives in the store for you possible dissatisfaction.
The increase in variety can't make up for the incredibly high expectations we have when offered many choices, some choice is better than no choice, but next to unlimited amount of choice does not equal higher satisfaction but the opposite.

So... there was this psychological experiment where there's two groups, and each participant is asked to make two drawings but can only have one of them. In group A, the participant gets to choose which one he gets. In group B, the Experimenter chooses which of your two drawings you get. After a couple months, they called up people in group A and found that group A people were more likely to be dissatisfied with their chosen drawing, which suggests that most people--in this context--would prefer to have no autonomy over the matter. (Of course, that implication doesn't follow for various reasons--one being that the study had something like 30 people, which is too small a sample size to generalize the results).

Somewhat but not quite. I'm not arguing that no choice is better than some choice, but rather that some choice is better than lots of choices. Quite a bit of difference there especially when expanded to the financial sector.
I was thinking of an experiment where one testgroup was allowed to choose an item out of a handful few items to take with them home, and another had lots of different items to choose from. Contrary to what we might instinctivly suspect, when they were polled about how much they appreciated their item, those who had little choice were happier than those who had much choice.

BigBallinStalin wrote:Maybe that's what you mean. I guess, but do you think happiness is a function of some range of choices or is happiness mostly a function of much more internal mechanisms (psychological factors)? I'd opt for the latter, so I'd be hesitant to blame the existence of more choices. You can give some people the world, and they still won't be satisfied.

This is not some people though, this is how most if not all of us work, we get more choices, our expectations go up, we're more likely to regret our choices, we blame ourselves for not making a better decision, we end up being less happy because we have an excessive amount of choice.
You would assume your happiness can be modified through exercising free will wouldn't you? Man, you individualists scare me, you think you have control of your own happiness?

gillipig is back!!! i retreat my membership refund question

I don't mind having selection. What I hate is people who don't randomize their selection. I bring my dice into bars, so I can make sure to not make biased decisions. If there are 15 beers, its a longer randomization process, that's it.

Anything else is just cheating... can you imagine if instead of dice, the attacker just arbitrarily decided how many troops each side lost? Yea, that's fucking great.

Selection is the AIDS of consumerism. When you go to a place you should get something. You already probably non-randomly chose the place ffs.

I hate capitalism.

Gillipig wrote:

BigBallinStalin wrote:

Gillipig wrote:

BigBallinStalin wrote:It depends on how much you complain about having so many choices.

The more choice you have the less happy you will be with what you choose, because you will have higher expectation on what you just bought. And you are more likely to regret what you bought because you are assuming that with so many options you could probably have gotten someting better. And to top it off you will end up blaming yourself for not making a better choice. Unlike when there's a small amount to choose from, where you will blame the lack of alternatives in the store for you possible dissatisfaction.
The increase in variety can't make up for the incredibly high expectations we have when offered many choices, some choice is better than no choice, but next to unlimited amount of choice does not equal higher satisfaction but the opposite.

So... there was this psychological experiment where there's two groups, and each participant is asked to make two drawings but can only have one of them. In group A, the participant gets to choose which one he gets. In group B, the Experimenter chooses which of your two drawings you get. After a couple months, they called up people in group A and found that group A people were more likely to be dissatisfied with their chosen drawing, which suggests that most people--in this context--would prefer to have no autonomy over the matter. (Of course, that implication doesn't follow for various reasons--one being that the study had something like 30 people, which is too small a sample size to generalize the results).

Somewhat but not quite. I'm not arguing that no choice is better than some choice, but rather that some choice is better than lots of choices. Quite a bit of difference there especially when expanded to the financial sector.
I was thinking of an experiment where one testgroup was allowed to choose an item out of a handful few items to take with them home, and another had lots of different items to choose from. Contrary to what we might instinctivly suspect, when they were polled about how much they appreciated their item, those who had little choice were happier than those who had much choice.

BigBallinStalin wrote:Maybe that's what you mean. I guess, but do you think happiness is a function of some range of choices or is happiness mostly a function of much more internal mechanisms (psychological factors)? I'd opt for the latter, so I'd be hesitant to blame the existence of more choices. You can give some people the world, and they still won't be satisfied.

This is not some people though, this is how most if not all of us work, we get more choices, our expectations go up, we're more likely to regret our choices, we blame ourselves for not making a better decision, we end up being less happy because we have an excessive amount of choice.
You would assume your happiness can be modified through exercising free will wouldn't you? Man, you individualists scare me, you think you have control of your own happiness?

I simply doubt that the findings of such a small sample size are applicable to the world, but 'too many choices'--whatever that may be--can cause 'paralysis'. That's easy to avoid though: simply omit some of the choices. Narrow it down through basic decision-making.

RE: underlined, sure, to a large degree, happiness is a function of internal factors. Of course, if someone is punching you in the face, then it becomes more difficult. If I had a girlfriend, I would hardly care about what happens outside my little world. There's plenty of evidence of people working within themselves to increase their happiness, so I don't see the problem with the 'individualist' view.

If you don't have any expectations (which isn't probably possible), how would that affect one's happiness? Do expectations themselves, regardless of their level, contribute to happiness' incline/decline?


--Andy

AndyDufresne wrote:If you don't have any expectations (which isn't probably possible), how would that affect one's happiness? Do expectations themselves, regardless of their level, contribute to happiness' incline/decline?


--Andy

This is Off-Topics, Andy. Nice try being philosophical.

Regarding the question at hand: No, it isn't.

- JBlombier

JBlombier wrote:

AndyDufresne wrote:If you don't have any expectations (which isn't probably possible), how would that affect one's happiness? Do expectations themselves, regardless of their level, contribute to happiness' incline/decline?


--Andy

This is Off-Topics, Andy. Nice try being philosophical.

Regarding the question at hand: No, it isn't.

- JBlombier

--Andy

Gillipig wrote:I'm starting to believe it is. Argue with me why it isn't so. (btw, I have low expectations on this conversation )

The world says Happiness comes with much wealth or much food/drink or many carnal activities outside of marriage or much material things. The Bible paradoxically says:
Blessed are the poor in spirit (non-arrogant/ humble), for theirs is the kingdom of heaven (receive eternal life).
Blessed are those who mourn (b/c of violating God's law), for they shall be comforted. (All sin forgiven).
Blessed are the meek (subservient), for they shall inherit the earth.
Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness (God), for they shall be filled (blessings temporally on earth & eternally in Heaven).
The blessings continue Matthew 5:1-& following.
---------------------
I know the Bible is foolishness to you & I'm a fool for believing there is a God, you asked and are searching for answers. The Bible has the truth you seek and need.

Expectations are just planned disappointments.

I think there is a distinction between expectations (which gets into an entitlement mentality) as opposed to setting goals and attempting to reach those goals.

When one sets a goal and then reaches that goal (often through hard work, sweat, tears and sometimes blood) it gives one a much greater sense of satisfaction. If one does try and fail to reach one's goal, then they can take solace in the fact that they actually tried their best at a goal that was unattainable at that time.

So one lowers one's goals.

A baby gets frustrated at trying to take it's first steps but receives immense satisfaction and happiness upon finally being able to take it's first steps without falling. So it should be in one's life. Baby steps, each step bringing it's own satisfaction and happiness and extending one's reach further for greater satisfaction and happiness but with increased difficulty which only makes it that much more rewarding.

I think it appears to be very easy to over-think a hell of a lot of things.

Expectations can interfere with lots of things, including happiness, because they are not always rational or based on reality. High expectations can easily be followed by disappointment which certainly doesn't make you happy.

Two beers or fifteen beers to select from doesn't matter if both parameters include your favorite beverage. If the beer is off when you drink it would certainly be a disappointment. If the fifteen choices are all bottles with a wide range of prices marked on the label and you pick an expensive one expecting something special, disappointment might follow.

AoG would be much happier if he didn't expect girls to sleep with him and just enjoyed their company instead.

So basically, expectations can be a problem.

The secret to happiness is not to pin it on material things entirely.
It's great to have money, and stuff, but there's more to life than that. I'm relatively well-off now, though without the disposable income I had a coupla years back. But I was happier when I was pretty much money-free than most people I know are, most of the time. Attitude, that's what it's about.

Probably.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151821771181035

DoomYoshi wrote:I don't mind having selection. What I hate is people who don't randomize their selection. I bring my dice into bars, so I can make sure to not make biased decisions. If there are 15 beers, its a longer randomization process, that's it.

Anything else is just cheating... can you imagine if instead of dice, the attacker just arbitrarily decided how many troops each side lost? Yea, that's fucking great.

Selection is the AIDS of consumerism. When you go to a place you should get something. You already probably non-randomly chose the place ffs.

I hate capitalism.

Yeah, it's the only thing I miss about communism. The fact that shopping was so efficient. Back home I'd go into a store and say, "I want pants." They'd ask, "green or purple?" They didn't ask, "what kind?", because there was only one kind. They didn't ask, "what size?" because there was only one size. This year they'd have a choice of green or purple, next year they might have a choice of black or blue. One decision, and the shopping was done.

Here in Canada there are 27,000 brands, and 27,000 types, and 27,000 sizes, and a simple thing like buying a pair of pants takes a college degree and half the afternoon. By the time I'm done I want to blast the place with a flamethrower.

At least when I first came to Canada, there would be salespeople on salary who would give you useful suggestions. Now the salespeople are all commission-only, and the only suggestion they ever make is that you buy something more expensive than you need or want. I want to blast them with a flamethrower too.

The secret to happiness is dreaming about punching Gillipig in the face

Army of GOD wrote:The secret to happiness is dreaming about punching Gillipig in the face

It's good to have realistic goals in your life AoG, your fists could never reach that far up in the air. Wish yourself a ladder first before you wish to punch me in the face.

The secret to happiness is giving AoG a tall ladder.

and boxing lessons.