Fans of the HBO show will appreciate this. The creator of the show gives a glimpse at where season 4 was going as well as many incredibly interesting comments on why the show got canceled and how the inner workings of corporate cable companies played out at the time and a uniquely objective perspective on the show as well as the real history of the Old West.
Milch is a modern day Shakespeare but, he stands on his own. The greatest artist know who they are, but a painter disappointed that he can't paint like DaVinci is selling himself short. Let him inspire you in his disdain for his own rarely recognized brilliance. What type of artist are you? A writer?

For people who do not know about the city or the HBO show Deadwood about 8 years ago, you can get a taste of the environment as well as a great look at the main character hardware store owner/Sheriff Seth Bullock and see what he's all about from the first scene of the first episode.
**Strong language and Extreme Historical Accuracy!
I just watched them backwards to the way you posted them.
Made to the 13 minute mark of the top vid, where he talked about the practice of starving the Chinese girls they brought in to use in the discount brothel. Quite horrific. Darkly funny when he says, "They don't re-enact that daily in Deadwood." Need to get going, might watch the rest later.
Drove through South Dakota in 2012. Rapid city, sturgis and across the interstate on the way home. It's pretty sparse in places. Not much has changed except less side arms and pick up trucks replace horses for going to town.
Had a fantastic steak dinner in a kind of modern Saloon, they treat like a single room bar and restaurant. Town is called Murdo.
Stopped in Wall, they have a cool history of a drug store that offered free ice water and built the town because of it during the early time of motor cars.
2dimes wrote:I just watched them backwards to the way you posted them.
Made to the 13 minute mark of the top vid, where he talked about the practice of starving the Chinese girls they brought in to use in the discount brothel. Quite horrific. Darkly funny when he says, "They don't re-enact that daily in Deadwood." Need to get going, might watch the rest later.
Drove through South Dakota in 2012. Rapid city, sturgis and across the interstate on the way home. It's pretty sparse in places. Not much has changed except less side arms and pick up trucks replace horses for going to town.
Had a fantastic steak dinner in a kind of modern Saloon, they treat like a single room bar and restaurant. Town is called Murdo.
Stopped in Wall, they have a cool history of a drug store that offered free ice water and built the town because of it during the early time of motor cars.
Yeah...the Asians in Deadwood then burned the whores bodies in the streets which caused quite a stink. There was a 'hubbub' between the races over trying to be respectful of their 'culture and tradition' or else if they should grab their balls, throw them on the table, as tell them the town was not going to allow Asians to burn their whores in the streets. Milch shines the light a few times on the dark realities of 'what makes things work'. The larger picture of the Asian whore thing was that George Hearst shipped in the immigrants, to drive prices down and destabilize the economy thus the entire city...so the ultra-rich could then scoop it up for pennies on the dollar. The more things change, the more they stay the same, eh?
Did you see the TV series? Even though there were only 3 seasons, I have to rate it right up there with Breaking Bad and Walking Dead, and I say straight up it's better than Boardwalk Empire. I finished it a couple weeks ago, and I'm still reading into the history of Deadwood and Wild Bill Hickok and Seth Bullock. What a story! the 14 minute mark in the top video is thee line between the first half and what season 4 would have been about, and the second half which is about everything but the characters of the show (except a bit about Wild Bill), and why things happened the way they did, and about people's want for conclusions to things that never concluded.
I'm not much for TV. I did get the 90s version of tombstone bluray for Christmas (mostly because of Val's Doc Holiday) I might have to check out deadwood.
As a weird middle aged guy I find the eighties style swearing a bit odd in the context of cowboys. I have been around real cowboys for a long time on occasions and while they swear constantly it is a much different linguistic style. That is how these things go though. Still bugs me.
Kind of like watching nazis with shakesperian accents or something.
Part of rural life is the diversity of accents depending on where each person is from. That is part of what caused so much division and racism. The new guy sounded different so most guys were dicks about it. If you could laugh along, occasionally you were ok if not you became, That crazy russian/scotsman/chinaman/nigger/whatever, it is kind of horrible but just how it was. Some cowboys are just plain mean, doesn't matter what you do they're going to give everyone a hard time, more so if you were different.
i remember i was flatmate with my cousin at that time and he used to be a huge fan of this show while i never really got into it.. but it was probably like season 1 at the time. I don't know, the pilot and all weren't enough catchy for me. I heard more about the real city of deadwood later on and some of the historical wild west figures that lived there.
riskllama wrote:one of my favourite tv shows ever. not sure how "historically accurate" their cussin' was, tho. swearingen is king!!!
Per the cussin... Basically, Deadwood was a mining town full of miners. And back then people were different than today. There were no how are ya todayz and where ya from convos. And in the wild west there were a lot of people who did not want to be found, not to mention people just minded their own business more and did not poke their noses into others biz, in general. Swearin and cussin was a way to communicate strongly and have force in your voice as well as ward people off/away when you wanted to be left alone,all without really saying anything of informational value. Plus it was occupational. Today you may have heard said 'swearin like a truck driver' or yesterday 'swearin like a sailor'. Pretty sure in the top video I shared in the OP lost season 4, the creator says he based the cussin on the letters he researched from Deadwood and from the time period in the West in general.
2dimes wrote:...while they swear constantly it is a much different linguistic style.
Some of the exchanges sound more to me like the way people spoke after movies like Lethal Weapon. It is a bit of an HBO thing too.
I suspect anyone not wanting to be found would typically have to keep moving. Lack of, "Minding their own business." has always been an issue in small towns and rural life. In a place were you might be a days ride from "the law" neighbors looked out for one another and don't take as kindly to a stranger that no one knows. It's still that way.
So everyone tries to look in on their neighbors. You might know several people you could rely on, in the area between you and your cousin who lives several days away, that you like to visit when you can.
I think you're right in a work camp like Deadwood, there might be some people trying to make a fresh start of things. It would be the kind of place you probably could change your name and blend in if you were careful enough about it. For sure the place would have some pretty nasty sorts. There would be guys, willing to work unreasonably hard to try to save up money for their family, or in hopes of having one someday also. Some of them would be corrupted to different degrees as well.
Often the worst people were probably the ones everyone actually knew were up to no good but seemed too powerful to mess with like that Swearinger character. He would probably speak different depending who he was speaking to and where.
Most would "clean up" their language around preachers, women folk and children. Sometimes you meet a cowboy who is unable to avoid the cussin'.
riskllama wrote:also, als' #2 dan(i think?). is the gay dude in "the last of us" - looks just like him, too!
as well as Warren 'frank n beans' in Something about Mary
Also flabbergasted to learn Garret Dillahunt played two characters in Deadwood, Jack McCall (who shot and killed Wild Bill Hickok), and Francis Wolcott, an employee of George Hearst.
favorite quote was from Wolcott. Upon displaying he had no morals, no conscious, and all he cared about was money and didn't care who needed to be killed for him to get what he wanted....
I am a sinner that does not expect forgiveness. But I am not a government official.
thegreekdog wrote:I'm in to the second season (once I purchased a subscription to HBO). It's a good show; not sure it's in my top 10.
Well, finish it out then let's see, What are your top10, or 5 or 3 even? I thought Boardwalk Empire fizzled a little too much, whereas Deadwood delivered consistently.
(1) The Wire (2) Battlestar Galactica (3) Firefly (4) Band of Brothers (and the Pacific) (5) The West Wing (6) Lost (7) Star Trek: The Next Generation (8) The Sopranos (9) Breaking Bad (10) The Unit
Honorable Mention: The Walking Dead, The Practice (and Boston Legal), Oz
My Top 10 TV shows (comedy)
(1) Monthy Python's Flying Circus (2) The Simpsons (3) Boy Meets World (4) How I Met Your Mother (5) South Park (6) Friends (7) The Office (8) The Cosby Show (9) Living Single (10) It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia
thegreekdog wrote:My Top 10 TV shows (non-comedy):
(1) The Wire (2) Battlestar Galactica (3) Firefly (4) Band of Brothers (and the Pacific) (5) The West Wing (6) Lost (7) Star Trek: The Next Generation (8) The Sopranos (9) Breaking Bad (10) The Unit
Honorable Mention: The Walking Dead, The Practice (and Boston Legal), Oz
My Top 10 TV shows (comedy)
(1) Monthy Python's Flying Circus (2) The Simpsons (3) Boy Meets World (4) How I Met Your Mother (5) South Park (6) Friends (7) The Office (8) The Cosby Show (9) Living Single (10) It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia
Dating site style, we'd be 98% incompatible. I've tried more than a few of your favorites and I couldn't get into it. Sopranos twice, Simpsons more than that. The rest I've seen are as many as the once's I haven't seen. I was going to try The Wire, but Free Showtime I got to watch HOMELAND season 4. WOW It was amazing! I suppose if I had to, Office would have to be in my top 10, because I know it's really funny when I watch it, but I haven't watched it wcwn a dozen times, maybe 2 or 3 whole episodes... OBV tho South Park is at my top along with Bill Maher, just not into comedy shows I guess, more the movie type. Chappeles show top 5. Breaking Bad n Walking Dead are in my top 5, and I admit that's not saying much as I never really cared for TV shows until I started having weekends off so I'm not that seasoned either. I know 'John Adams' was a mini-series, but it's in my top 3. I enjoyed Pacific, even though I only checked it out because Hans Zmmer scored it, pretty good, not top 10 tho for me. True Detective's was EXCELLENT! Rusty Cohle/Matthew McCoughnahy's spiritual arc, coolest thing I ever seen. Homeland, if you haven't seen it....well, actually it might not fit on your kinda list. Weeds, was great for the first half, but couldn't say it's my favorite. DeadWood, I loved it. I'm even watching dEadwood again but not sure I will finish a second round, something I almost did with breaking bad, and have done dozens of times with John Adams. I suppose that's how we gotta rank em, if we watched the entire show more than once around?
I watched some of Sons of Anarchy. I liked it, but it got repetitive (at least for me).
I liked Homeland a little bit. I never saw John Adams (certainly on my list) and I saw the first episode of True Detective. In the interest of full disclosure, I unfortunately don't have a lot of time to watch TV and when I do watch TV, the show usually has to be compatible with my wife's tastes (erego, I have not seen most of Game of Thrones. I have not seen the last two seasons or so of the Walking Dead.) I have a lengthy list and it grows daily.
Just sharing an experience... around 2008 (whenever John Adams was released on HBO) I was of the mind that cable TV was a 'luxury' For 20-30$, sure, I'd get it, but here in MN where Comcast has a lock on many aspects of the market, it's 60-70$, unless you combo it with internet, then it's 90$ total, which puts you around 110-115$ after taxes fees n surcharges. Of course, that's when they pitch the triple play (phone) for 99$.... So I was working in New Jersey for a couple months and the room had HBO, and I caught a couple moments of John Adams...on the spot it smacked me in the face....
Couldn't help but be humbled and in many ways grateful for knowing a lifeso far) of total peace and order. Anyways when I got back home I set out with my ginormous bonus earnings to spend something on myself (straight double time + overtime at double salary x 1.5 of which I worked not a single day less than 16 hours)to purchase the 3-disc series of seven 2-hour episodes. I went to Circuit City (closest) and they wanted $72.99 for it! I was shocked by the price, so I went up a few more blocks to Best Buy. They wanted $64.99. Still, too much for me, even with a huge check which had more deductions/taxes taken out of it than I regularly netter in 40 hour work week. Drove to the next city over, Wal-mart .....BOOM!!! $39.99!
I've watched it at least 100 times, nay, hundreds if times! Not the whole thing, but I would play it on DVD when I went to sleep. Almost every weeknight, picking up on the last part I could remember, finishing about 1 episode per week. That worked for about a month, and it got so good I dedicated a whole Saturday to watch the last 3 episodes, and Sunday I watched all 7 episodes again. Later on I even went and purchased the 700 page book, which was (as usually is the case) better than the movie. I used the same system for reading the book as I did for watching the show, but applied it to the throne room (dumper) reading 5-10 minutes at a time. That went on for a long time, until I went to work in Denver. Read on the plane ride there, and until I feel asleep in the hotel room, the plane ride back it was finished.
It's extremely interesting to see the changes Tom Hanks (director) made from the book. I also wonder what percentage of the population can know this? There were only a couple changes, and while the movie stays 98% with the book and the letters written to and from the Adams family, the changes are extremely powerful as the series clearly takes a highly effective all or nothing knock out shot criticizing each founding father.
page 647...
The roar of cannon grew louder as the hours passed, and in midafternoon a thunderstorm struck. "The artillery of Heaven" as would be said - to be followed by a gentle rain.
He lay peacefully, his mind clear, by all signs. Then late in the afternoon, according to several who were present in the room, he stirred and whispered clearly enough to be understood, "Thomas Jefferson survives."
At about 6:20 on July 4th, his heart stopped. John Adams was dead.
As those present would remember ever after, there was a final clap of thunder that shook the house; the rain stopped and the last sun of the day broke through the dark, low hanging clouds - "bursting forth with uncommon splendor at the moment of his exit, with a sky beautiful and grand beyond description."
By nightfall, the whole town knew.
And estimated 4,000 people crowded silently about the First Congregational church on July 7th. A suggestion that the funeral of President John Adams be held at public expense at the State House in Boston had been rejected by the family, who wish no appearance of "forcing" public tribute and public expense, and asked that the service be kept as simple as possible, as Adams had wanted.
Cannon boomed from Mount Wollaston, bells rang. Pastor Peter Whitney officiated, taking his text from I Chronicles: "He died in good old age, full of days, and with honor." With the service ended, the body of John Adams was laid to rest beside that of his wife, in the graveyard across the road from the church.
That John Adams and Thomas Jefferson had died on the same day, and that it was , of all days, the Fourth of July, could not be seen as a mere coincidence: it was a "visible and palpable" manifestation of "Divine favor" wrote John Quincy in his diary that night, expressing what he felt and would be said again and again everywhere the news spread.
John Adams by David McCullough
True Detectives, I won't say anything other than 'AWESOME' and the ending was one of the most unique warm n fuzzies I have ever witnessed along with a most fantastic spiritual/religious arc from start to finish that nobody would ever see coming.
Only vaguely on topic, but since you're discussing different shows... I would highly recommend The Borgias, on Showtime. It was cancelled after season 3, even though there was supposed to be a season 4 to wrap it all up. Still, awesome show. If you like period pieces, and especially if you liked the HBO show Rome, then you'll probably like it. Great show. I'm still super disappointed they cancelled it. Jeremy Irons makes an excellent evilish pope.
There were only a couple changes, and while the movie stays 98% with the book and the letters written to and from the Adams family, the changes are extremely powerful as the series clearly takes a highly effective all or nothing knock out shot criticizing each founding father.
