Conquer Club

From the time their children are born, French parents provide them with a firm cadre—the word means "frame" or "structure." Children are not allowed, for example, to snack whenever they want. Mealtimes are at four specific times of the day. French children learn to wait patiently for meals, rather than eating snack foods whenever they feel like it. French babies, too, are expected to conform to limits set by parents and not by their crying selves. French parents let their babies "cry it out" (for no more than a few minutes of course) if they are not sleeping through the night at the age of four months.

...

Consistently enforced limits, in the French view, make children feel safe and secure. Clear limits, they believe, actually make a child feel happier and safer—something that is congruent with my own experience as both a therapist and a parent. Finally, French parents believe that hearing the word "no" rescues children from the "tyranny of their own desires."

lawl. Are those abnormal concepts in the US?

mrswdk wrote:

From the time their children are born, French parents provide them with a firm cadre—the word means "frame" or "structure." Children are not allowed, for example, to snack whenever they want. Mealtimes are at four specific times of the day. French children learn to wait patiently for meals, rather than eating snack foods whenever they feel like it. French babies, too, are expected to conform to limits set by parents and not by their crying selves. French parents let their babies "cry it out" (for no more than a few minutes of course) if they are not sleeping through the night at the age of four months.

...

Consistently enforced limits, in the French view, make children feel safe and secure. Clear limits, they believe, actually make a child feel happier and safer—something that is congruent with my own experience as both a therapist and a parent. Finally, French parents believe that hearing the word "no" rescues children from the "tyranny of their own desires."

lawl. Are those abnormal concepts in the US?

Yes, unfortunately.

*****

so mrs - do you actually live in china, or...? coz y'know. little chinese emperor kids wtfbbqetc.

also it's patently untrue that no french children have adhd.

khazalid wrote:so mrs - do you actually live in china, or...? coz y'know. little chinese emperor kids wtfbbqetc.

Well, sure, if you look online you can see a lot of people ranting about how all kids these days are 'little emperors' whenever they see a story about a kid behaving outrageously, but the majority of children I come across here are perfectly respectful and obedient. Most parents are way too hell-bent on producing a kid that is a borderline superhuman to ever permit their kid to become a pampered little brat.

Methinks there's more than a little confirmation bias going on amongst the people who think that kids today are all spoiled princes and princesses.

khazalid wrote:so mrs - do you actually live in china, or...? coz y'know. little chinese emperor kids wtfbbqetc.

also it's patently untrue that no french children have adhd.

The article doesn't say that French kids don't have ADHD.

What a load of crap. "Overdiagnosis" is the key word here not to mention the pharmaceutical companies pushing their crap...can't, for instance, have a tv or radio on or page thru a mag without being innundated by "I HAVE A PILL FOR THAT!"....disgusting.

It's a damn hard job but I have managed to raise 2 well adjusted happy boys without drugs and psychochyatrists.....and without pills for mommy and daddy....and thankfully I'm not french (no offense Betiko.....actually minored in french in college for what it's worth )

The next major issue is plain old laziness and selfishness of people that shouldn't reproduce and want the docs and the pharms to ease their burdens.....let's make a test to pass for people to procreate! Obviously MHO here....

KoolBak wrote:What a load of crap. "Overdiagnosis" is the key word here not to mention the pharmaceutical companies pushing their crap...can't, for instance, have a tv or radio on or page thru a mag without being innundated by "I HAVE A PILL FOR THAT!"....disgusting.

It's a damn hard job but I have managed to raise 2 well adjusted happy boys without drugs and psychochyatrists.....and without pills for mommy and daddy....and thankfully I'm not french (no offense Betiko.....actually minored in french in college for what it's worth )

The next major issue is plain old laziness and selfishness of people that shouldn't reproduce and want the docs and the pharms to ease their burdens.....let's make a test to pass for people to procreate! Obviously MHO here....

Koolbak.... Theres a Visine for that.

Kool you can't possibly be comparing your situation to the typical Canuckistan/Americano existence.

You take your family outside all the time camping and feed them home made food from decent ingredients.

My kidlets need more exercise, they are starting to get short attention spans from too much laying around. Have to send them bike riding while mrs dimes and I try to catch some fish.

mrswdk wrote:

khazalid wrote:so mrs - do you actually live in china, or...? coz y'know. little chinese emperor kids wtfbbqetc.

Well, sure, if you look online you can see a lot of people ranting about how all kids these days are 'little emperors' whenever they see a story about a kid behaving outrageously, but the majority of children I come across here are perfectly respectful and obedient. Most parents are way too hell-bent on producing a kid that is a borderline superhuman to ever permit their kid to become a pampered little brat.

Methinks there's more than a little confirmation bias going on amongst the people who think that kids today are all spoiled princes and princesses.

ad hominem that i am, i can attest that there is no confirmation bias going on. actually, my hometown (like many other university towns in the uk) has a fairly large contingent of chinese students now, who are , to a man (& woman), quiet, studious and respectful. my first actual encounters with the education system here were eye-opening, to say the least. basic parenting skill seems to have passed a great many by. perhaps it is the fact that for many chinese kids nowadays, the parents are not even the primary care-givers. perhaps it is merely a generational thing. regardless, it is.

Yeah dude....'preciate it....still pisses me off Thank the gods for Rye Whisky ;o)

ps - Here's a video you'll dig Brother Dimey

Snowbirds Tank Cam:

http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/Tanks-Eye-View-223886-1.html

2dimes wrote:Kool you can't possibly be comparing your situation to the typical Canuckistan/Americano existence.

You take your family outside all the time camping and feed them home made food from decent ingredients.

My kidlets need more exercise, they are starting to get short attention spans from too much laying around. Have to send them bike riding while mrs dimes and I try to catch some fish.

khazalid wrote:

mrswdk wrote:

khazalid wrote:so mrs - do you actually live in china, or...? coz y'know. little chinese emperor kids wtfbbqetc.

Well, sure, if you look online you can see a lot of people ranting about how all kids these days are 'little emperors' whenever they see a story about a kid behaving outrageously, but the majority of children I come across here are perfectly respectful and obedient. Most parents are way too hell-bent on producing a kid that is a borderline superhuman to ever permit their kid to become a pampered little brat.

Methinks there's more than a little confirmation bias going on amongst the people who think that kids today are all spoiled princes and princesses.

ad hominem that i am, i can attest that there is no confirmation bias going on. actually, my hometown (like many other university towns in the uk) has a fairly large contingent of chinese students now, who are , to a man (& woman), quiet, studious and respectful. my first actual encounters with the education system here were eye-opening, to say the least. basic parenting skill seems to have passed a great many by. perhaps it is the fact that for many chinese kids nowadays, the parents are not even the primary care-givers. perhaps it is merely a generational thing. regardless, it is.

I really don't understand what you're talking about. My experience of primary/high school age students here is that they are generally fairly obedient and have parents who keep them in their place. Tell a naughty school kid you're going to ring their parents about their bad behavior and they'll shit their pants. Parents are way too freaked about producing a super child to allow their kids to turn into little shits.

KoolBak wrote:Yeah dude....'preciate it....still pisses me off Thank the gods for Rye Whisky ;o)

ps - Here's a video you'll dig Brother Dimey

Snowbirds Tank Cam:

http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/Tanks-Eye-View-223886-1.html

No rye for me thanks.

I suspect if I was a single parent everyone in the household would be on pills including the pets.

That movie was filmed up in Glide country according to the guys at the pilot's forum I bum around at. Beautiful British Columbia, Comox.

mrswdk wrote:

khazalid wrote:

mrswdk wrote:

khazalid wrote:so mrs - do you actually live in china, or...? coz y'know. little chinese emperor kids wtfbbqetc.

Well, sure, if you look online you can see a lot of people ranting about how all kids these days are 'little emperors' whenever they see a story about a kid behaving outrageously, but the majority of children I come across here are perfectly respectful and obedient. Most parents are way too hell-bent on producing a kid that is a borderline superhuman to ever permit their kid to become a pampered little brat.

Methinks there's more than a little confirmation bias going on amongst the people who think that kids today are all spoiled princes and princesses.

ad hominem that i am, i can attest that there is no confirmation bias going on. actually, my hometown (like many other university towns in the uk) has a fairly large contingent of chinese students now, who are , to a man (& woman), quiet, studious and respectful. my first actual encounters with the education system here were eye-opening, to say the least. basic parenting skill seems to have passed a great many by. perhaps it is the fact that for many chinese kids nowadays, the parents are not even the primary care-givers. perhaps it is merely a generational thing. regardless, it is.

I really don't understand what you're talking about. My experience of primary/high school age students here is that they are generally fairly obedient and have parents who keep them in their place. Tell a naughty school kid you're going to ring their parents about their bad behavior and they'll shit their pants. Parents are way too freaked about producing a super child to allow their kids to turn into little shits.

What is this phenomenom you're talking about parents obssesed with producing a super kid. Everywhere i look i see parents having no clue about what they're doing, mildly depressed about their responsabilities, confused about whats the point of the struggle.

------That tends to happen. When most of them are 14/15 year old parents on Maury. Although that sort of thing was O.K.,when taming the Old West(but they did pay for their own kids). Then for a long time,you where evil to have a kid at that age. 21st century it's KOOL again.free money to take care of your kids. God Bless America..cough...I wish I was in Dixie! I'll make my stand in Dixie! ConfederateSS.out!(The Blue and Silver Rebellion)......Like a flash..It was "Gone With The Wind"...

Well anecdote incoming, but it's just to provide a counter argument. (and FWIW I support the french philosophy).

I have lived life as an undiagnosed case of ADHD. I dont know what the magnitude of my symptoms are but its usually takes only a few minutes for an outside observer to notice my tics and fidgets.

Even sitting down doing something I know I will enjoy I have a kind of itch to "find" (its not really find, hard to describe) a distraction, and when I am concentrating, I tend to rush/panic easily. Every one of my sports coaches over the years has told me to "slow down" no matter what it was.

I view my entire childhood with embarrassment. Pictures of me as a kid are often mid tantrum where i'd be crying or raging because i didnt get my own way. I was a horrible child.

If I had been given a well structured course of treatment, which included medication where appropriate, I am fairly confident myself, and my parents, would be much happier; I would not have wasted nearly a decade of my life struggling in the workplace; and I would not be left with a burden of learned coping mechanisms that I now have to unlearn (or accept, though the chewed up pens littering my desk is pretty gross).

http://www.additudemag.com/adhdblogs/11/9378.html

They have Ritalin and other meds like Prozac for adults here loot, maybe ask your doctor.*














































* Side effects include...

I don't think we're on a Disney property anymore Toto.

My point was that, sure, the French way is lovely and all, but there's still a number of kids that would benefit hugely from medication, no matter how well structured and designed their upbringing was.

The exact number of kids that fit this criteria is a known unknown, but I would suggest that it is less than the 9% you see in the US, but still higher than the 0.5% you see in France.

Point five is one in two hunnerd. Sounds about right to me.

Maybe, I have bias because I am a sufferer.

You're doing it wrong. I have never suffered.

You mean the road trip to Oregon was completely blissful???