Conquer Club

You know, in The Netherlands we have no inferiority complex, because we have accepted our negligible influence in the world. We just get by, knowing we're quite lucky being born in this wealthy society and we simply live our lives. There is even a myth that foreigners, especially people that aren't from Europe, think of The Netherlands as that small country next to Amsterdam, because our country itself is insignificant. You guys play geography based maps, so I don't have to tell you that Amsterdam is our capital, but last weekend, our little myth happened to be somewhat true. I was amused.

Pharrell Williams performed on Pinkpop, a relatively big festival. It's held just outside of this really small place with 37,5k citizens (about 200 km away from our capital). But apparently our nation revolves entirely around said capital, because Pharrell shouted "Yeah, Amsterdam!", "What's up, Amsterdam!" consistently for at least 6 times throughout his performance. So of course we got some angry Dutchies, especially the ones from that area.
This is probably because most people of The Netherlands wouldn't mind if that province was still part of Belgium, but let's not get into that right now.
I find it extremely funny that our country is known for only one place, because it appeals the most to human fantasy (whores and drugs!.1 yeah¡!.) and that's it. Well, there's a new stream of Chinese people coming to Giethoorn, but that's just embarrassing, because it's like a big (village shaped) fake museum of what Holland used to be a 100 years ago, kept intact purely for the Chinese. Horrible.

Anyway, my point is not that Pharrell should've known he was in a shithole of a town instead of Amsterdam. It's amusing, but I can't blame him. I guess my point is that it's amazing that what we see as our entire world, isn't even known to most other people. Our (the CC-community's) geographic knowledge is far above average and still we don't know half of the places our beloved (and not so beloved) forum regulars live in. I don't think it's bad, the human brain is just too small. I was just contemplating about this...

You can thank your "wealthy" country's being to the racist slave traders that dominated the Dutch market during colonial times (and to greedy American revolutionists trying to jack start a national economy).

Plus, do you really think this is appropriate?

DaGip wrote:Plus, do you really think this is appropriate?

Yes. Zwarte Piet is black because of all the chimneys he had to climb through. It has nothing to do with africans.
Any child in Belgium and the Netherlands knows this.

@JBlombier: We've got the same problem over here. According to a study I read some years ago, there are more americans that know Brussels, than there are who know Belgium.
Every now and then they might also know Bruges, Waterloo or Bastogne by name; but most of the world seems oblivious to small countries.

If your country was important, people who know its geography better

Thanks for bringing it up, DaGip. As for the picture you posted, I don't think it's appropriate at all and from the moment I was old enough to form a valid opinion, I've voiced my opinion about this. Also, you're getting into this discussion a few years too late, so I'll let it go for now. Come to Holland in December, we'll have a blast (probably not, but at least we can make a point together). The tradition itself was formed in complete innocence (as waauw also mentioned), but it's outdated.

I was gonna name Belgium, Denmark and countries like that as well for example, but thought it'd be somewhat of an insult. I'm glad you brought up Belgium yourself, waauw, hehe.

Absolutely true, AoG...

Army of GOD wrote:If your country was important, people who know its geography better

I think I can identify two American states!

I think I can name about a third, maybe half, the US states and point most of them on a map.
Most educated people will probably at least know Hawaii, Alaska, New-York, Florida, California and Texas.

Everyone* I know from the Netherlands says that Utrecht is a shithole

*sample size = 2

JBlombier wrote:what we see as our entire world, isn't even known to most other people

And it's not just geography. Your stories and history only carry so far as well. Take something like the Holocaust that the Nazis carried out - it's an enormous part of European history, but the average south east or east Asian won't know anything about it.

It works the other way round as well, obviously - plenty of things that are hugely important in Asia are complete mysteries to Europeans. The world's a huge place, and none of us are as important as we like to think we are.

mrswdk wrote:

JBlombier wrote:what we see as our entire world, isn't even known to most other people

And it's not just geography. Your stories and history only carry so far as well. Take something like the Holocaust that the Nazis carried out - it's an enormous part of European history, but the average south east or east Asian won't know anything about it.

It works the other way round as well, obviously - plenty of things that are hugely important in Asia are complete mysteries to Europeans. The world's a huge place, and none of us are as important as we like to think we are.

IN GENERAL I agree with you. There are some exceptions, however. For instance, just about everyone knows Greece is out of money and there's trouble there. Same goes for Santa Barbara Sheriff Bill Brown's summer clam bake. I'd be surprised if there are many people in the world that haven't heard of it, even if they're unlikely to attend. There have been at least three articles in the Santa Barbara News-Press and Sheriff Bill Brown's Facebook page has received hundreds of likes each time it's been posted. Bill Brown even rode his horse up and down main street last weekend handing out flyers he'd photocopied at the FedEx Office.

Oh yeah, and in case I forgot to mention, last year's summer clam bake even made CNN after Snakes McGraw had reportedly been seen stealing Coronas from Bill Brown's cooler -



(turned out it was just a rando)

People who read the international news in detail know about Greece. There are plenty of people here whose first question would be 'Europe has a single currency?'

saxitoxin wrote:

They could not look any more like a group of American policemen if they tried

mrswdk wrote:

saxitoxin wrote:

They could not look any more like a group of American policemen if they tried.

EXCUSE ME, that is the Santa Barbara SHERIFF's Office - Sheriff Bill Brown and his three Chief Deputy Sheriffs.

The Santa Barbara POLICE Department is led by Camerino Sanchez. You will NOT find me talking about him EVER here after the incident with me and the algae bloom at Gaviota Beach.



NOT EVER

So you'd rather be a brown shirt than a black shirt?

mrswdk wrote:People who read the international news in detail know about Greece. There are plenty of people here whose first question would be 'Europe has a single currency?'

UK is in Europe, so easily forgotten.

I want examples mrswdk. I know in the bloodthirsty nuclear nations Tamerlane is a big deal, where over here nobody knows what he actually famous for.

Does the Book of Rites count? Does the average SE Asianer care in which order the meat on the bones comes in compared to the roast meat and sauces?

Of things that east Asians care about that Europeans have never even heard of?

That big wall u got, i n china ...? whats it called ... big wall.com...?

I met a couple once from US in Visby, Gotland... they asked me if that wall were put up every year for Tourists.... i replied that "wall" were build like 400 years Before Columbus "discovered" america ...

Sad thing that history and geography are sliding down the ash tray

The US is extrapolated from the remnants of the economic cooperation union and is therefore woefully biased.

Lord Arioch wrote:That big wall u got, i n china ...? whats it called ... big wall.com...?

I met a couple once from US in Visby, Gotland... they asked me if that wall were put up every year for Tourists.... i replied that "wall" were build like 400 years Before Columbus "discovered" america ...

Sad thing that history and geography are sliding down the ash tray

lol. Like the old story about an American couple who went to the tourist information center in Windsor and asked why they built the castle so close to an aiport.

Yup:)
People today sadly lack the basic knowledge... im not an expert on anything but i know a fair bit of chines history, latinamerica, african and well to make it short a fair bit of history... but ive been a history nerd since i was like 9... and studied history in some form at university for 8 years ...
One of my favourites is this prof i read who said that the first world war were well kind of an isolated EU happening then he wrote like 10 pages on it and spended like 50 pages on the far east at the same period claiming that what happened there then ere of much greater importance for the world...

its strange that we seem to know less and less even though we have greater and greater acces to information...

the fun thing in history are all the weird anecdotes u can find ... like this native american tribe who got inte their heads that since the britts burned their villiages they should go to them and burn theirs so they went out paddled like hell and a bit out in the ocean they met a slave ship ... well guess what happened ...

i Once took a course in paleografi ... dont know how to translate it ... it means that u study 1500-1600 hundred handwrinting...
Well in gothenburg 2 farmers went to the market to sell their cows. met this servant from the castle and forced him by threat to give them booze. drank it all and wanted more but the servant refused ... so they beat him up and had to pay their cows in fine ... standard swedish friday night to this day!

In the really olden days here a travelling musician, that were wronged by the population would be taken up on a hill, with a cow ... then u shaved the tail on the cow, greased it, the musican then took hold of said tail and the judge whipped the cow if the musician could hold on the cow were his otherwise he were to suffer the scorn of the populace

dont get me started

Lord Arioch wrote:One of my favourites is this prof i read who said that the first world war were well kind of an isolated EU happening then he wrote like 10 pages on it and spended like 50 pages on the far east at the same period claiming that what happened there then ere of much greater importance for the world...

Knowing very little of asian history, would you mind enlightening me?

LoL the bloody book is 600 pages...

But well the russian revolution would have greater impact on the world in the long view.
Japans war with russia in 1905 the first time asia deafeted a EU country. To build up in japan and the industrilization there and the occupation and growth of japan that eventually led to ww2...

The main thing is that loads of stuff happened 1900-1920 that would have a lot more impact on the world as a whole than WW1 ... i know how that sounds ... ww1 were horrible but it were mainly an isolated European event and loads and loads of stuff went on all over the world that would have impact in latin america u have revolutions, US starts to take on a more active role in the world ...

Enuff or u want an essay:)

Its easier in hindsight to say that were important that were not

It all comes down i think to long term impact and short term... if we didnt had WW2 the impact of WW1 would have been greater ... now the WW1 were basiclly and ending of the conflicts occurring during the 1800s nappy, the german-french war and so on...
We EU people tend to look a bit to much at our own importance, and imagine everyone does ... things went on all around as this period much faster and with much more long term impact than anyone at the time could forsee... as it does now in 50 years we will say fudge why didnt we see that comming...BBS as world prez .... or AoG in the white house ... or well u get the pict:)

And i highly recommend a closer study od asian history its way cool and way important grece and china have had HUGE impacts on us. And china is one (if not he) of the oldest countries in the world around 6000 years of unbroken history ... when we had the bloody ice age they inveted stuff we almost cant to today

Then they slowed down a bit .... until today:)

There was also the Chinese revolution in 1911.