Conquer Club

It seems like the Americans are going to screw it up, not only for themselves, but for the rest of the world.

As the president of US can execute actions that affects the whole world, why is not the whole world also involved in the election?

IF that little-fingered bastard gets in power, confirming the declining of the American hegemony, the effects of the transition from the US dominance to a Chinese one will be quite chaotic, and who knows actually what will happen in the next 4 years.

If the American are not educated enough to vote, the rest of the world should intervene and bring them to reason.

That is somewhat the remit of the united nations.

And if American is moronic enough to muck up their global position then we should not help them stay there. They are not a bank, they are big enough to fail.

There should be 3 options on the ballot form -

Trump
Clinton
None of the above

Let's not exagerate here. Whoever gets elected will still need the support of congress. Trump is powerless if he doesn't get the rest of the republican party behind him.

Yeah, I read it in the Washington Post that if Trump got elected he would immediately start nuking Pakistan before banning all imports to America from abroad.

And he said some rude stuff about people during the TV debates so obviously the above is all true.

waauw wrote:Let's not exagerate here. Whoever gets elected will still need the support of congress. Trump is powerless if he doesn't get the rest of the republican party behind him.

Congress is powerless without the support of the president.

A powerless government for 4 years will be just as crippling.

waauw wrote:Let's not exagerate here. Whoever gets elected will still need the support of congress. Trump is powerless if he doesn't get the rest of the republican party behind him.

Except that's proven wrong but presidential executive orders

America may not be a bank. But we have the Federal Reserve and every country on the earth needs it as of now. You do know if that bank fails the whole world fails. Is it Americas fault that other countries bought the lies of the US? Every country gets what they deserve for buying faith in a faithless system. Mutual destruction was the idea and nobody wanted it. To bad we have crazy steering the ship for the last 100 years. Kick the can down the road long enough to reach the next generation and let them figure it out.

warmonger1981 wrote:America may not be a bank. But we have the Federal Reserve and every country on the earth needs it as of now. You do know if that bank fails the whole world fails. Is it Americas fault that other countries bought the lies of the US? Every country gets what they deserve for buying faith in a faithless system. Mutual destruction was the idea and nobody wanted it. To bad we have crazy steering the ship for the last 100 years. Kick the can down the road long enough to reach the next generation and let them figure it out.

Why do we need the federal reserve? I understand why we need chinese investment funds, but I fail to see how america is important to us.....?

Oh I see, you guys are unaware that weve been transitioning for a while now

Falkomagno wrote:It seems like the Americans are going to screw it up, not only for themselves, but for the rest of the world.

As the president of US can execute actions that affects the whole world, why is not the whole world also involved in the election?

IF that little-fingered bastard gets in power, confirming the declining of the American hegemony, the effects of the transition from the US dominance to a Chinese one will be quite chaotic, and who knows actually what will happen in the next 4 years.

If the American are not educated enough to vote, the rest of the world should intervene and bring them to reason.

Could you also please tell me how to worship, dress, eat, think and feel about guns? Dumbass.....

Merica!

Nope well aware of countries like India,Pakistan and China creating it's own economic corridor. Or how Muammar Gaddafi tried creating a gold dinar. The world is waking up to American hippocracy. Brittain is waking up to its own EU scam. Tell me this then. How would the world function if the American Dollar collapsed today. Ever heard of Bretton Woods. It set up the IMF, World Bank and International Bank for Reconstruction and Development . At least two of those rely heavily on the American Dollar for investment. If the dollar fails today the world feels it tomorrow.

warmonger1981 wrote:Nope well aware of countries like India,Pakistan and China creating it's own economic corridor. Or how Muammar Gaddafi tried creating a gold dinar. The world is waking up to American hippocracy. Brittain is waking up to its own EU scam. Tell me this then. How would the world function if the American Dollar collapsed today. Ever heard of Bretton Woods. It set up the IMF, World Bank and International Bank for Reconstruction and Development . At least two of those rely heavily on the American Dollar for investment. If the dollar fails today the world feels it tomorrow.

So? It's not a question of "if", it's a question of when. There have been economic collapses in the past and there will be more in the future and civilization is still here. When the American dollar collapses the same thing will happen as every other time the reserve currency has collapsed, a replacement will be found.

The U.S. is not unique in electing scumbags. I see all kinds of garbage winning elections all over the world.

I'm not even American and I'm offended by the insulting implication of the OP that the rest of the world is somehow smarter. People around the world are susceptible to the same problems of groupthink, kneejerk reactions to stimuli, and susceptibility to marketing ploys and buzzwords. If the rest of the world was invited to vote in U.S. elections, the results might be different, but they'd be unlikely to be any better.

Dukasaur wrote:The U.S. is not unique in electing scumbags. I see all kinds of garbage winning elections all over the world.

I'm not even American and I'm offended by the insulting implication of the OP that the rest of the world is somehow smarter. People around the world are susceptible to the same problems of groupthink, kneejerk reactions to stimuli, and susceptibility to marketing ploys and buzzwords. If the rest of the world was invited to vote in U.S. elections, the results might be different, but they'd be unlikely to be any better.

The point is that in general terms, if Italy elect a Berlusconi, it has a way smaller effect that if US elect, well, its Berlusconi version.

Your point is that the rest of the world is not inherently smarter to know better, which is a very interesting point, then the problem is that democracy is flawed if uneducated people are able to vote. But that is a much broader discussion.

In this particular case, the prevalence of trump is being seeing as a scary thing for the rest of the world.

Falkomagno wrote:

Dukasaur wrote:The U.S. is not unique in electing scumbags. I see all kinds of garbage winning elections all over the world.

I'm not even American and I'm offended by the insulting implication of the OP that the rest of the world is somehow smarter. People around the world are susceptible to the same problems of groupthink, kneejerk reactions to stimuli, and susceptibility to marketing ploys and buzzwords. If the rest of the world was invited to vote in U.S. elections, the results might be different, but they'd be unlikely to be any better.

The point is that in general terms, if Italy elect a Berlusconi, it has a way smaller effect that if US elect, well, its Berlusconi version.

Your point is that the rest of the world is not inherently smarter to know better, which is a very interesting point, then the problem is that democracy is flawed if uneducated people are able to vote. But that is a much broader discussion.

In this particular case, the prevalence of trump is being seeing as a scary thing for the rest of the world.

Trump doesn't scare me nearly as much as the Bushes did, and we survived 16 years of them. We'll survive Trump, too.

Democracy is flawed, its just better than the current alternatives.

Falkomagno wrote:Your point is that the rest of the world is not inherently smarter to know better, which is a very interesting point, then the problem is that democracy is flawed if uneducated people are able to vote. But that is a much broader discussion.

And what exactly do you mean by 'educated'?

The premise of representative democracy is that everyone gets a say in who represents them in the senate/parliament/wherever. Other it's not 'representative democracy', it's 'representative-of-a-small-subsection-of-the-population democracy'. That 'mainstream' politicians have been deliberately ignoring the people who are now voting for populists out of anger or anti-establishment sentiment is exactly why those populists are currently able to succeed. And your solution is to tell those people 'we care about your views so little that we're going to lock you out of the system'? Great idea, enjoy the revolution.

WingCmdr Ginkapo wrote:Democracy is flawed, its just better than the current alternatives.

When in doubt, quote Churchill then drop the mic.

Dukasaur wrote:

Falkomagno wrote:

Dukasaur wrote:The U.S. is not unique in electing scumbags. I see all kinds of garbage winning elections all over the world.

I'm not even American and I'm offended by the insulting implication of the OP that the rest of the world is somehow smarter. People around the world are susceptible to the same problems of groupthink, kneejerk reactions to stimuli, and susceptibility to marketing ploys and buzzwords. If the rest of the world was invited to vote in U.S. elections, the results might be different, but they'd be unlikely to be any better.

The point is that in general terms, if Italy elect a Berlusconi, it has a way smaller effect that if US elect, well, its Berlusconi version.

Your point is that the rest of the world is not inherently smarter to know better, which is a very interesting point, then the problem is that democracy is flawed if uneducated people are able to vote. But that is a much broader discussion.

In this particular case, the prevalence of trump is being seeing as a scary thing for the rest of the world.

Trump doesn't scare me nearly as much as the Bushes did, and we survived 16 years of them. We'll survive Trump, too.

12 years idiot. Bush Sr. was not a bad President. The Conservatives wanted him out! Bush Jr. was a failure.

The DOLLAR is king and the Chinese are still hiding their money in US Treasury Bonds and in the US econony.

Americans will come to their senses in November. Every time Trump opens his big mouth and waves his small hands, Americans will cone to the realization that Trump is a phony and is as crazy as bat shit.

Bernie Sanders wrote:Americans will come to their senses in November. Every time Trump opens his big mouth and waves his small hands, Americans will cone to the realization that Trump is a phony and is as crazy as bat shit.

Yeah yeah, I think we heard that line about three times a week from media commentators the entire way through the Republican primaries, and look how those finished.

WingCmdr Ginkapo wrote:Democracy is flawed, its just better than the current alternatives.

True enough.

mrswdk wrote:

WingCmdr Ginkapo wrote:Democracy is flawed, its just better than the current alternatives.

When in doubt, quote Churchill then drop the mic.

Sometimes, when it's already been said accurately, there really isn't more to say.

Bernie Sanders wrote:

Dukasaur wrote:

Falkomagno wrote:

Dukasaur wrote:The U.S. is not unique in electing scumbags. I see all kinds of garbage winning elections all over the world.

I'm not even American and I'm offended by the insulting implication of the OP that the rest of the world is somehow smarter. People around the world are susceptible to the same problems of groupthink, kneejerk reactions to stimuli, and susceptibility to marketing ploys and buzzwords. If the rest of the world was invited to vote in U.S. elections, the results might be different, but they'd be unlikely to be any better.

The point is that in general terms, if Italy elect a Berlusconi, it has a way smaller effect that if US elect, well, its Berlusconi version.

Your point is that the rest of the world is not inherently smarter to know better, which is a very interesting point, then the problem is that democracy is flawed if uneducated people are able to vote. But that is a much broader discussion.

In this particular case, the prevalence of trump is being seeing as a scary thing for the rest of the world.

Trump doesn't scare me nearly as much as the Bushes did, and we survived 16 years of them. We'll survive Trump, too.

12 years idiot. Bush Sr. was not a bad President. The Conservatives wanted him out! Bush Jr. was a failure.

The DOLLAR is king and the Chinese are still hiding their money in US Treasury Bonds and in the US econony.

Americans will come to their senses in November. Every time Trump opens his big mouth and waves his small hands, Americans will cone to the realization that Trump is a phony and is as crazy as bat shit.

Bush Sr. was a profoundly evil man. Before running for office, he was part of the CIA administration that destabilized at least half a dozen countries in the Caribbean and Central America.

He engineered the Iran-Contra deals even though Reagan accepted the blame, and in case you think they were a tempest in a teapot, they were not. The last shred of American moral high ground that Americans occupied vanished with Iran-Contra, and nobody has called you the bastion of democracy since then.

Bush engineered Gulf War I, which was the beginning of the process of destabilizing the Middle East that his son continued and which is now a core part of U.S. policy. And I use the term "engineered" quite intentionally. Saddam got American re-assurances that the U.S. would not interfere in his dispute with Kuwait, and once he was all-in, suddenly the tune changed and the repressive Kuwaiti regime was our beloved darling. All international law was thrown out the window to invade Iraq, not to mention outright fraud in the U.S. Congress. (Remember Suffer the Children? Here's a reminder, if your memory is weak: http://www.prwatch.org/books/tsigfy10.html)

Incidentally, here's the real Bernie Sanders discussing Bush Sr.'s war:



The term "regime change" is synonymous with Bush Sr., both during the CIA years and during his presidency. Maybe he even invented it. I don't think there will ever be a full body count of all the wars and revolutions that are directly or indirectly spun from the Bush web.

mrswdk wrote:

WingCmdr Ginkapo wrote:Democracy is flawed, its just better than the current alternatives.

When in doubt, quote Churchill then drop the mic.

We have democratic systems across that actively prevent from a large proportion of society from bekng the representative.

The issue in America isnt that americans are stupid voters, its that there is a political system which promoted Trump and Clinton to being the only possible representatives.

Falkomagno wrote:It seems like the Americans are going to screw it up, not only for themselves, but for the rest of the world.

Sure, you can vote for ours if we can vote for yours.

Hell, do the damn numbers. China will have more influence on the elections of the rest of the world than It will have over it's own elections.

P.S. World already screwed. Good news: Wars are no longer being fought over salt.

WingCmdr Ginkapo wrote:

mrswdk wrote:

WingCmdr Ginkapo wrote:Democracy is flawed, its just better than the current alternatives.

When in doubt, quote Churchill then drop the mic.

We have democratic systems across that actively prevent from a large proportion of society from bekng the representative.

Native English speaker say what?

The issue in America isnt that americans are stupid voters, its that there is a political system which promoted Trump and Clinton to being the only possible representatives.

Trump managed to get nominated despite being opposed by just about everyone within the pre-existing political power structure, Sanders almost managed the same.

I don't know how America's senate/congress elections work but as far as president goes, people in America are free to vote for any one of the 6/7 other candidates running against Clinton and Trump. If they would rather do so but choose not to then that is their own choice.