Conquer Club

Fraternitas Saturni


The Fraternitas Saturni was founded in the wake of the so-called "Weida Conference" in 1925. It succeeded the "Collegium Pansophicum, Orient Berlin" (Pansophia Lodge), a Rosicrucian magical order founded by Heinrich Traenker, a notable German occultist of the time. The Weida Conference was meant to consolidate Aleister Crowley's claims to be the Outer Head of Ordo Templi Orientis and the expected World Teacher. The conference consisted of Crowley's entourage of Leah Hirsig, Dorothy Olsen, and Norman Mudd and the members of Heinrich Traenker's "Pansophia Lodge". Traenker had served as a X° National Grand Master of the German O.T.O. under Theodor Reuss up until Reuss's death. Also attending the conference were the notable film pioneer Albin Grau and Gregor A. Gregorius.[4]

The conference was not a smooth event and Traenker withdrew his support of Crowley. The differences between Traenker and Crowley led to a schism in the Pansophical Lodge between the brothers who disagreed with Crowley and those who accepted Crowley's Law of Thelema, including Gregorius and Grau. Following these differences the Pansophical Lodge would be officially closed in 1926. Those brothers of the Pansophia Lodge who accepted the teachings of Crowley would join Grosche in founding the Fraternitas Saturni - but without Albin Grau.[5][6]


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraternitas_Saturni

I think that is quite peculiar. AMORC claims to be a keeper of gnostic Christianity. Mr Crowley was quite open and vocal about his claim to be the head of the church of Satan. What are your thoughts warmonger?

2dimes wrote:I think that is quite peculiar. AMORC claims to be a keeper of gnostic Christianity. Mr Crowley was quite open and vocal about his claim to be the head of the church of Satan. What are your thoughts warmonger?

What do I think about what? Rosicrucianism or OTO? Or you just talking Crowley?

I was just wondering if you had an opinion on the whole thing in general. I'm not trying to lead you anywhere.

founded in the wake of the so-called "Weida Conference" in 1925. It succeeded the "Collegium Pansophicum, Orient Berlin" (Pansophia Lodge), a Rosicrucian magical order founded by Heinrich Traenker, a notable German occultist of the time. The Weida Conference was meant to consolidate Aleister Crowley's claims to be the Outer Head of Ordo Templi Orientis and the expected World Teacher.

That seems peculiar. They should oppose but that states it "was meant to consolidate." I'm not surprised but if that is accurate, there was some misrepresentation in a book I read published by the ancient mystical order.

2dimes wrote:I was just wondering if you had an opinion on the whole thing in general. I'm not trying to lead you anywhere.

founded in the wake of the so-called "Weida Conference" in 1925. It succeeded the "Collegium Pansophicum, Orient Berlin" (Pansophia Lodge), a Rosicrucian magical order founded by Heinrich Traenker, a notable German occultist of the time. The Weida Conference was meant to consolidate Aleister Crowley's claims to be the Outer Head of Ordo Templi Orientis and the expected World Teacher.

That seems peculiar. They should oppose but that states it "was meant to consolidate." I'm not surprised but if that is accurate, there was some misrepresentation in a book I read published by the ancient mystical order.

Rosicrucian teachings are a combination of occultism and other religious beliefs and practices including Hermeticism, Jewish mysticism, and Christian Gnosticism. Also mixed with Alchemy. So in all actuality Rosicrucianism is more occultism. Aleister Crowley first started in Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn. He was kicked out of the order. I think after that is when he started OTO. Both organizations claimed a whole secret knowledge. Similar to Freemasonry. Some Freemasons believe their order started with Rosicrucianism. I believe that to be false. What are your thoughts?

warmonger1981 wrote:

2dimes wrote:I was just wondering if you had an opinion on the whole thing in general. I'm not trying to lead you anywhere.

founded in the wake of the so-called "Weida Conference" in 1925. It succeeded the "Collegium Pansophicum, Orient Berlin" (Pansophia Lodge), a Rosicrucian magical order founded by Heinrich Traenker, a notable German occultist of the time. The Weida Conference was meant to consolidate Aleister Crowley's claims to be the Outer Head of Ordo Templi Orientis and the expected World Teacher.

That seems peculiar. They should oppose but that states it "was meant to consolidate." I'm not surprised but if that is accurate, there was some misrepresentation in a book I read published by the ancient mystical order.

Rosicrucian teachings are a combination of occultism and other religious beliefs and practices including Hermeticism, Jewish mysticism, and Christian Gnosticism. Also mixed with Alchemy. So in all actuality Rosicrucianism is more occultism. Aleister Crowley first started in Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn. He was kicked out of the order. I think after that is when he started OTO. Both organizations claimed a whole secret knowledge. Similar to Freemasonry. Some Freemasons believe their order started with Rosicrucianism. I believe that to be false. What are your thoughts?

My parents were Rosicrucians for a couple years when I was a kid. They were pretty heavily into it for about 2 or 3 years until they woke up and realized it's just as bogus as every other religion.

I took the Alchemy course through the Rosicrucians, which was a lot of fun, but ultimately just that, fun. The practical applications of alchemy are, sadly, nonexistent. I remember I distilled Essence of Rosemary to try to make a girl fall in love with me, but she didn't.

It's funny, I was the child, but I saw through the nonsense a lot sooner than my allegedly adult parents. The very first Rosy publication I saw had a picture of their secretarial pool, and they were all sitting there in long skirts and button-up blouses buttoned right to the neck. I knew instantly that there was no way to reconcile Aleistar Crowley's (and my parents') belief in unrestrained Carnalism with these Middle American prudes. I knew right then and there that it was a business, same as any other. I took the Alchemy course because, as I've said, it was fun, but I never believed a single word of the mystical mumbo-jumbo.

Duke can you bust these off and make a Rosy cross thread.

I think if I were a Mason that thought it started somewhere else I would seek that root. Why do something that broke away? Typically they say, "The original broke so they had to break away to fix it." If it was the truth, how could it break? Kind of like the Church of England, the root was broke fair enough, but instead of dumping the whole thing people want to carry on doing the same stuff, then you end up with Catholic light.

I don't know much about Crowley at all really because he was honest enough about what he was doing. AMORC on the other hand like Duke said puts the magazine in a plain brown paper wrapper, pretending to be gnostic Christianity. My knowledge of them is pretty limited too because of they're secrecy. I do find them interesting though.

The Scottish rite has a branch called the Rose Croix. That is why they are the inferior masons.

That's going to leave a mark.

2dimes wrote:Duke can you bust these off and make a Rosy cross thread.

Done.

SORCERY!!

Not bad for a guy that can't even make love potion. Thanx.

In the eyes of a variety of esoteric and Hermetic practitioners, alchemy is fundamentally spiritual. Transmutation of lead into gold is presented as an analogy for personal transmutation, purification, and perfection.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alchemy

This is the way I believe it first began. The actual mixing of metals came later.

Philosophy – Alexandria acted as a melting pot for philosophies of Pythagoreanism, Platonism, Stoicism and Gnosticism which formed the origin of alchemy's character.[21] An important example of alchemy's roots in Greek philosophy, originated by Empedocles and developed by Aristotle, was that all things in the universe were formed from only four elements: earth, air, water, and fire. According to Aristotle, each element had a sphere to which it belonged and to which it would return if left undisturbed.[23] The four elements of the Greek were mostly qualitative aspects of matter, not quantitative, as our modern elements are; "...True alchemy never regarded earth, air, water, and fire as corporeal or chemical substances in the present-day sense of the word. The four elements are simply the primary, and most general, qualities by means of which the amorphous and purely quantitative substance of all bodies first reveals itself in differentiated form."[24] Later alchemists extensively developed the mystical aspects of this concept.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alchemy


This is the quickest way I could explain this. I read it in other books written by Pike in Mackey but Wiki get straight to the point.

DoomYoshi wrote:The Scottish rite has a branch called the Rose Croix. That is why they are the inferior masons.

Don't forget the order of the Knights of Malta. Although it is on the New York side.

But what about Bohemian Thosophy? Isn't that the best of of the obscure enlightenment seeking gnostisistic genres?

Buncha fookin phreakz

Is that connected to Bohemian Grove or seperate?

I love that the event is private yet so many outsiders are invited. My favorite was the quote from Nixon who just did not enjoy his visit. The Clintons on the other hand seemed to like it.

It's only one step away from Bohemian Rhapsody.

I am just a poor boy from a poor family, but it's relative innit?

From what I understand it's a recruitment center into higher societies. Basically who's going to do what to get what. Gotta prove your a piece of shit to move up. Kind of like Skull and Bones but for rookies. Now let me ask you guys if you know why Bohemia and the owl?

Not specifically but the owl is a symbol of wisdom and insider knowledge.

I like your avatar by the way. Where is it from?

2dimes wrote:Not specifically but the owl is a symbol of wisdom and insider knowledge.

I like your avatar by the way. Where is it from?

The owl also sees in the dark. Being able to guide itself in darkness.
Bohemia because of John of Nepomuk who was killed in Bohemia for not telling the queen secrets.

The avatar I found accidentally while looking for Masonic art. I have others but that's one of my favorites. I'll post one every day for my avatar.

Yeah, I kind of lost interest but I used to love going to Masonic museums and checking out the artifacts.

I think I'll google that John guy tomorrow.

You shouldnt oughtta rush into anything now.....

Dimey's schedule:

Tuesday - Google John.
Wednesday - Look oot window.
Thursday - Use the restroom.
Friday - Talk to chillun....

lmao

Weirdly enough, I did a fair bit of research into the Rosicrucians during one of my degrees. It was certainly a secret society, and you can even find a few genuinely good historians who got mislead by the idea of a secret history. It's just that the facts are mostly boring, or more accurately. interesting in other ways.

It's kind of the mist of history that makes them seem more than a men's club, or even a fraternity, at least on an international level.

They tend to get resurrected a lot as people look for the occult in history. I came across them looking into John Dee, for example. Turns out he's much more interesting as a scientist than a mystic.

I admire that you saw through the BS, Duk.