Everyone deserves a second chance...case in point the_lion

[ParadiceCity9]

so what, he still created multis, and tried to help burn down CC with his dark lord... he made his own decisions, and is big enough to live with those decisions. when you go against the owner/admins/mods and declare war on the forums and CC, you can't win. at the end of the day, they can kick you out the door.. oh, wait... yeah, that kind of happened, didn't it. regardless of what led up to it, the actions that some of you don't want consider in the entire affair, are the most important to several others of us that live by the rules and accept the consequences of our actions. i'm tired of receiving vague PM's from his supporters, refusing to tell me anything of merit to sway my opinion or make me understand any clearer... he did what he did, and you can't ignore any of it when reconsidering his perma-ban...-0

Owen who said anything about declaring war ? the dark lord .. very melodramatic of you ... I think you have other issues unrelated to the intention of this thread ...

Couldn't agree more...

[owenshooter]

I am not able to answer the question, but since the_lion is constantly being caught with multis (one was banned from chat just tonight even), I would assume they would say no.

4th post in this thread... enough said... this debate was over as soon as this hit the thread. he has not learned his lesson, and you delia, are as cryptic as ever. give us the scoop, give us the dirt. why should he be let off of his ban? he has not learned his lesson and continues to break the very rule you declare he has learned to obey... stop avoiding the relevant posts by others in this thread, and answer them. you can't dance around the subject. he is a violator of one of the CLEAREST RULES on this site. there isn't an unwritten rule about this. there isn't a vague rule left up to interpretation about this. the rule regarding what he did is as set as can be. and guess what? he continues to violate it, even in THIS thread! the thread you are trying to get him off of his ban for!! what a brilliant move by the defense!!!-0

[owenshooter]

Owen as always we can agree to disagree...

as always, you refuse to answer any of the pertinent questions or even accept the facts that people are putting before you. you state he has learned his lesson at the start of the thread. 4 posts in, a mod states he was just busted in live chat with another multi, AGAIN. in the thread, he continues to post with multis, in his own defense. hmmmm, yeah, he has learned his lesson. he broke a cardinal rule of CC that is as clear as clear can be, i mean, it is somewhere on the rule page.. maybe it was a bit too far down for him to see... let me find it...
Rule #1: No multiple accounts
OHHHH!!! it is the FIRST RULE OF CONQUER CLUB!!! how clear is that? where is the loophole that is open for debate? he is in here openly stating he is using multiple accounts to post in this thread. mods are busting him, still, in live chat!! what lesson has he learned? let me guess, if they let him back, he'll stop then? ok.. riiiight.. suuuuure. answer those, and theniwe may have a disagreement. keep avoiding them, like you always do, when someone confronts you with a FACT that cannot be debunked, and you are simply wrong. the ban should stand. he is not a one time offender. he is CC's WORST offender.-0

[Nikolai]

Honestly though, how else is he going to get the publics attention without making a multi? I mean we would have know way of knowing FOR SURE what he's saying unless he came here and said it himself.

And that right there is the reasoning that got him into this mess. See, the funny thing is, he doesn't need to get the public's attention. Didn't need to when he was having wicked problems, either. His multis at that time are what has caused the loss of premium that everyone is whining about. It's simple and within site rules. Now, if lack decides to be nice and let him stay premium, that's lack's prerogative... but lack doesn't owe lion anything.

lion's appearance in this thread, with his appeal to public opinion, is basically rabble-rousing. Might I suggest that breaking the rules to rabble-rouse is not the best way to show remorse, much less make lack feel kindly towards you?

[timmytuttut88]

Honestly though, how else is he going to get the publics attention without making a multi? I mean we would have know way of knowing FOR SURE what he's saying unless he came here and said it himself.

And that right there is the reasoning that got him into this mess. See, the funny thing is, he doesn't need to get the public's attention. Didn't need to when he was having wicked problems, either. His multis at that time are what has caused the loss of premium that everyone is whining about. It's simple and within site rules. Now, if lack decides to be nice and let him stay premium, that's lack's prerogative... but lack doesn't owe lion anything.

This thread, with its appeal to public opinion, is basically rabble-rousing. Might I suggest that breaking the rules to rabble-rouse is not the best way to show remorse, much less make lack feel kindly towards you?

You don't know the whole story. He made multis yes, THEN the mods told him to pay premium tog et his account back. He did, and they took it away with no reason whatsoever. He tried taking it up with lack and Lack has ignored him.

[timmytuttut88]

I am not able to answer the question, but since the_lion is constantly being caught with multis (one was banned from chat just tonight even), I would assume they would say no.

4th post in this thread... enough said... this debate was over as soon as this hit the thread. he has not learned his lesson, and you delia, are as cryptic as ever. give us the scoop, give us the dirt. why should he be let off of his ban? he has not learned his lesson and continues to break the very rule you declare he has learned to obey... stop avoiding the relevant posts by others in this thread, and answer them. you can't dance around the subject. he is a violator of one of the CLEAREST RULES on this site. there isn't an unwritten rule about this. there isn't a vague rule left up to interpretation about this. the rule regarding what he did is as set as can be. and guess what? he continues to violate it, even in THIS thread! the thread you are trying to get him off of his ban for!! what a brilliant move by the defense!!!-0

He is making a multi because some people don't believe him and he has to present his case. Basically the only way for him to present his case is for him to make a multi and write it on the forum. Or take it up with lack privately, and so far that hasn't happened.

[owenshooter]

Basically the only way for him to present his case is for him to make a multi and write it on the forum. Or take it up with lack privately, and so far that hasn't happened.

maybe you missed this part:

Rule #1: No multiple accounts

i don't see a caveat for any way to break that rule. how many multiples does he need to create, before it is enough? a few in live chat... a few for games... a few in this thread.. sprinkle a few around the forums... a few to try and persuade lack... great, let's set a precedent with this. hmmm, how could it go.. what would appease all of his defenders? perhaps:

Rule #1: No multiple accounts unless you have a really good reason.

does that work for you? doesn't work for me. the ban should stand-0

p.s.-i remember when i pm'd him that it was ridiculous he was polar_beast23,because everyone knew it, and he denied it up and down... 2 days later, perma-ban... enough said.

[timmytuttut88]

Basically the only way for him to present his case is for him to make a multi and write it on the forum. Or take it up with lack privately, and so far that hasn't happened.

maybe you missed this part:

Rule #1: No multiple accounts

i don't see a caveat for any way to break that rule. how many multiples does he need to create, before it is enough? a few in live chat... a few for games... a few in this thread.. sprinkle a few around the forums... a few to try and persuade lack... great, let's set a precedent with this. hmmm, how could it go.. what would appease all of his defenders? perhaps:

Rule #1: No multiple accounts unless you have a really good reason.

does that work for you? doesn't work for me. the ban should stand-0

p.s.-i remember when i pm'd him that it was ridiculous he was polar_beast23,because everyone knew it, and he denied it up and down... 2 days later, perma-ban... enough said.

Yes he made multis. I'm not denying it. The problem is that he paid his premium after he made them to get his account back a little bit ago, and then the mods took the premium away for no reason. So the_lion made a new account yesterday to present his case.

[owenshooter]

So the_lion made a new account yesterday to present his case.

that's funny, a mod posted this on the 7th, two days ago...

the_lion is constantly being caught with multis (one was banned from chat just tonight even)...

what he did was wrong, and popping into this thread with multiples shows he has not learned his lesson...-0

p.s.-read rule #1

[timmytuttut88]

So the_lion made a new account yesterday to present his case.

that's funny, a mod posted this on the 7th, two days ago...

the_lion is constantly being caught with multis (one was banned from chat just tonight even)...

what he did was wrong, and popping into this thread with multiples shows he has not learned his lesson...-0

p.s.-read rule #1

He has learned his lesson I know. He isn't making these multis to spite the mods, he isn't making them to cheat, he is making them merely to show his case. The more the mods ban him the more he's going to have to make to tell his story. If the mods would just let him be around for a week or so to tell them everything and sort the stuff out this might get solved.

Honestly Owen, I know he is making multis and that isn't allowed. But he has no choice, it's the only way for him to communicate with the mods since lately he hasn't been able to get a hold of them.

[chaosfactor]

You've Made your Point Owen, and I think we are all clear about what side of the fence you stand on, how about hearing a few other points?

The Taunt that Wicked played on was about "Toeing The Line", in reference to Moderator warnings, how-ever the Lion did not actually know that euphemism, and subsequently had a whole bunch of Flamers laughing at his expense. Wicked seeing her chance Pounced upon this Gem and wound Lion up a treat. The details I cannot find because the advance search will not cross link any References, possibly due to been deleted. That I guess we shall leave to The Lion.

What actually went on I missed, which was a shame, because we all like a good battle don't we?!?

[Snorri1234]

The Lion should be brought back. He was taunted by a moderator into a flame-off which seems like a silly reason to ban someone anyway. (Since cops can't trick people into committing crimes and then arresting them either.)

And after that, he paid premium and was still banned from the site, clearly out of line with regular policy.


I mean, it's your site and all that nonsense, but you're not being consistent and also scaring away a paying customer.

[owenshooter]

I mean, it's your site and all that nonsense, but you're not being consistent and also scaring away a paying customer.

no, they didn't scare him away, they tossed him out.-0

[deliaselene]

You've Made your Point Owen, and I think we are all clear about what side of the fence you stand on, how about hearing a few other points?

The Taunt that Wicked played on was about "Toeing The Line", in reference to Moderator warnings, how-ever the Lion did not actually know that euphemism, and subsequently had a whole bunch of Flamers laughing at his expense. Wicked seeing her chance Pounced upon this Gem and wound Lion up a treat. The details I cannot find because the advance search will not cross link any References, possibly due to been deleted. That I guess we shall leave to The Lion.

What actually went on I missed, which was a shame, because we all like a good battle don't we?!?

thanks chaos the references are tow the line and toe the line... I was thinking of the ban for describing a certain avatar...

[Nikolai]

He has learned his lesson I know. He isn't making these multis to spite the mods, he isn't making them to cheat, he is making them merely to show his case. The more the mods ban him the more he's going to have to make to tell his story. If the mods would just let him be around for a week or so to tell them everything and sort the stuff out this might get solved.

Honestly Owen, I know he is making multis and that isn't allowed. But he has no choice, it's the only way for him to communicate with the mods since lately he hasn't been able to get a hold of them.

He's learned his lesson? Really? And yet... he keeps doing it. Hardly convincing. I will say again that it doesn't matter why he's making multis. The point is that HE IS MAKING MULTIS. He hasn't learned anything.

You say he has to make them. I say that's bullsh*t. As I pointed out earlier, he doesn't have to make them to show his case. There's a system in place to put his case before the mods. Just because he, or you, or anyone else doesn't like the results or the time it takes to work through things is no reason to ignore the system. So he definitely doesn't need multis to communicate with the mods. This leaves us with one possibility... he's rabble-rousing. This is rude, obnoxious, and displays incredible disrespect for site administration and rules. Once again... no, he clearly hasn't learned anything here.

Oh, and for all those who seem to think that only they have the true understanding of what really happened... I present this little sequence of events which has been verified by some four different people who've pm'ed me.

He was the_lion.
He got banned for something randomly wicked-related. (Fair or not - doesn't matter.)
He multi'ed multiple times.
He got a new ISP or whatever, multi'ed, and paid for premium.
He got busted for being a multi... this being his fourth account? Maybe more... doesn't matter, four's enough... and he was a multi. Again.
He had his premium taken away for being a multi. (What's the normal penalty for four offenses? I still say the mods were being generous here.)
He multi'ed again to come in to the forum and whine. (Note that the second part of that is just my opinion and has no real weight... the important part is that he multi'ed. Again.)
Now having had at least five accounts, at present he has made absolutely certain that any penalty that might have previously been undue is now justly earned.

Oh, and Fireside_Poet has added the new information that he's currently a 7-time multi.

[owenshooter]

thanks chaos the references are tow the line and toe the line... I was thinking of the ban for describing a certain avatar...

delia, you have yet to respond to any of the facts i have asked you about. you are vague, you are aloof, you change the subject. i directed several posts at you, and others tried to answer them, but not you. seems like if you are going to start a thread trying to get someone a "second chance" for the umpteenth time, you should be willing to answer the tough questions with rational responses. you have yet to do that. stop ducking, skirting the issues, and answer ONE question with something other than a vague remark. odd, you only respond to people that post in your favor, and even then, it is a "thank you." this is a very poor way to sway anyone. the ban should stand.-0

[timmytuttut88]

He's learned his lesson? Really? And yet... he keeps doing it. Hardly convincing. I will say again that it doesn't matter why he's making multis. The point is that HE IS MAKING MULTIS. He hasn't learned anything.

um yes it does matter. he's not making them to spam all he's doing is making them to present his case. IT's his only way to communicate with the mods. Remember that.

You say he has to make them. I say that's bullsh*t. As I pointed out earlier, he doesn't have to make them to show his case. There's a system in place to put his case before the mods. Just because he, or you, or anyone else doesn't like the results or the time it takes to work through things is no reason to ignore the system. So he definitely doesn't need multis to communicate with the mods. This leaves us with one possibility... he's rabble-rousing. This is rude, obnoxious, and displays incredible disrespect for site administration and rules. Once again... no, he clearly hasn't learned anything here.

So what do you propose he should do instead?

[AndyDufresne]

Making multis is "not his only way to communicate with the mods"--That's what the e-ticket system is for.

Again, this is mostly a private matter, and not a public one.


--Andy

[timmytuttut88]

Making multis is "not his only way to communicate with the mods"--That's what the e-ticket system is for.

Again, this is mostly a private matter, and not a public one.


--Andy

Well the mods said (i think it was you) that he should upgrade to premium. He did and it was taken away again. So the e-ticket system (or whatever system he used to communicate to you guys) didn't exactly work there.

[Nikolai]

He's learned his lesson? Really? And yet... he keeps doing it. Hardly convincing. I will say again that it doesn't matter why he's making multis. The point is that HE IS MAKING MULTIS. He hasn't learned anything.

um yes it does matter. he's not making them to spam all he's doing is making them to present his case. IT's his only way to communicate with the mods. Remember that.

Pretty sure I answered that objection in the second section of my post... oh, wait.

You say he has to make them. I say that's bullsh*t. As I pointed out earlier, he doesn't have to make them to show his case. There's a system in place to put his case before the mods. Just because he, or you, or anyone else doesn't like the results or the time it takes to work through things is no reason to ignore the system. So he definitely doesn't need multis to communicate with the mods. This leaves us with one possibility... he's rabble-rousing. This is rude, obnoxious, and displays incredible disrespect for site administration and rules. Once again... no, he clearly hasn't learned anything here.

So what do you propose he should do instead?

And... Andy beat me to it. But that's the answer... work through the established channels. They really are there for a reason.

[timmytuttut88]

And... Andy beat me to it. But that's the answer... work through the established channels. They really are there for a reason.

Maybe capslock could help you get this:

HE TRIED THAT AND THE MODS SAID TO UPGRADE TO PREMIUM. HE DID AND THEY TOOK IT AWAY FOR NO REASON. HE DECIDED TO TELL THE PEOPLE OF THE FORUM THIS BECAUSE NOTHING ELSE WAS WORKING.

[timmytuttut88]

He got banned for something randomly wicked-related.
He multi'ed severeal times
He got a new IP or whatever, multi'ed, and paid for premium. so shouldnt he have his account back since he upgraded to premium?
He got busted for being a multi when he hadnt made any new multis since upgrading, so why is his premium revoked???
He had his premium taken away for being a multi.
He multi'ed again to come in to the forum and whine. since the mods were contradicting themselves
Now having had at least five accounts, at present he has made absolutely certain that any penalty that might have previously been undue is now justly earned.

Oh, and Fireside_Poet has added the new information that he's currently a 7-time multi.

[Nikolai]

He got banned for something randomly wicked-related.
He multi'ed severeal times
He got a new IP or whatever, multi'ed, and paid for premium. so shouldnt he have his account back since he upgraded to premium? Umm... No. It was a multi account.
He got busted for being a multi when he hadnt made any new multis since upgrading, so why is his premium revoked??? Because the new account was a multi account.
He had his premium taken away for being a multi.
He multi'ed again to come in to the forum and whine. since the mods were contradicting themselves Doesn't matter why.
Now having had at least five accounts, at present he has made absolutely certain that any penalty that might have previously been undue is now justly earned.

Oh, and Fireside_Poet has added the new information that he's currently a 7-time multi.

*sigh* What's hard about this?

[timmytuttut88]

He got banned for something randomly wicked-related.
He multi'ed severeal times
He got a new IP or whatever, multi'ed, and paid for premium. so shouldnt he have his account back since he upgraded to premium? Umm... No. It was a multi account.
He got busted for being a multi when he hadnt made any new multis since upgrading, so why is his premium revoked??? Because the new account was a multi account.
He had his premium taken away for being a multi.
He multi'ed again to come in to the forum and whine. since the mods were contradicting themselves Doesn't matter why.
Now having had at least five accounts, at present he has made absolutely certain that any penalty that might have previously been undue is now justly earned.

Oh, and Fireside_Poet has added the new information that he's currently a 7-time multi.

*sigh* What's hard about this?

Yup you got a mistake.

He had to upgrade to premium, and he used a new account to do it. That's not against the rules.

When you upgrade to premium you can either upgrade your old account or the multi one. plus if the mods were saying to upgrade and taking away the money when he did upgrade that's a problem...he had to say something to the public.

[Nikolai]

You missed my point. He bought premium on a multi account... before he was busted. He got busted for that account, which was, in fact, a multi. His premium was taken away. All perfectly reasonable and in accordance with site rules.