Does Terminator encourage non strategic playing?

[OliverFA]

So far I have played mostly Terminator games at CC, and sometimes I catch myself doing a not very smart movement with the excuse of killing some player to get the points.

The fact is that most times the movement that you have to do to kill a player and get the points is not the same move that you should do in order to maximize your chances to finish the game. If you kill the player and get the points, then you risk losing the game. But if you play to win, then you risk other players killing the weaker ones (even if they lose the game by doing so) and leting you almost without points even if you win the game.

The conclussion seems to be that Terminator encourages "bad" playing if you want to get the most points. Am I right?

[BaldAdonis]

It's not bad, just different. As long as you gain points, it's a good play. You might not get as much as you could, so it might not be the best, but it's still not bad.

[Bruceswar]

It's not bad, just different. As long as you gain points, it's a good play. You might not get as much as you could, so it might not be the best, but it's still not bad.

I totally disagree with this statement. This is why many people who are higher ranked will not play public terminator. People rank hunt and suicide you for your points. They are then swept off the board and somehow call it a success, Terrible play is more like it. Sure you might stretch a bit to make a kill, but never to the point where the next guy can sweep you off the board.

[comic boy]

I would say a good standard escalating strategy can be used to good effect in terminator but the reverse is not always true , certainly I have seen regular ' terminator ' players make more than their fair share of bad kills when reverting to the standard game.

[Prankcall]

I play lots of public Terminator.I found for the most part it's played very much like Standard (atleast that's how I play it) I never go for a kill unless I can survive and I play to win the game not pick up 9-15 points by killing someone which weakens me to the point where I can be killed.The thing I find more is playing the same people in a bunch of the games I'm in.This happens the most on Classic map as most prefer to play this map.In order to get a variety of players I need to change maps once in awhile or not create the games but join them.I'm playing for unique kills not points so that might be why I never go after ranks/points.

[Sentinel XIV]

It's not bad, just different. As long as you gain points, it's a good play. You might not get as much as you could, so it might not be the best, but it's still not bad.

I totally disagree with this statement. This is why many people who are higher ranked will not play public terminator. People rank hunt and suicide you for your points. They are then swept off the board and somehow call it a success, Terrible play is more like it. Sure you might stretch a bit to make a kill, but never to the point where the next guy can sweep you off the board.

Agreed, Bruce. I will stretch a bit if I can gain some points, but not to the point where I leave myself open for elimination. And I certainly would never purposely thin another player out with a bad move. However, anyone that joins a terminator game should know that some players will go all out for the points against a higher rank. I mean, if a cook takes a major, that's something close to 50 points, more or less, with the cook probably losing somewhere near 10 points when he/she is eliminated. I'm sure they would consider that a swing in their favor.

[Snorri1234]

So far I have played mostly Terminator games at CC, and sometimes I catch myself doing a not very smart movement with the excuse of killing some player to get the points.

The fact is that most times the movement that you have to do to kill a player and get the points is not the same move that you should do in order to maximize your chances to finish the game. If you kill the player and get the points, then you risk losing the game. But if you play to win, then you risk other players killing the weaker ones (even if they lose the game by doing so) and leting you almost without points even if you win the game.

The conclussion seems to be that Terminator encourages "bad" playing if you want to get the most points. Am I right?

It's not bad playing because that's the entire purpose of the game.

[jonesthecurl]

Well, If I have no chance of winning a terminator game, but might get some point before I go out, I'll probably go for it. But I wouldn't risk a possible win just to take someone out for their points.

[OliverFA]

I would say a good standard escalating strategy can be used to good effect in terminator but the reverse is not always true , certainly I have seen regular ' terminator ' players make more than their fair share of bad kills when reverting to the standard game.

Escalating and Terminator seem to go in the same direction. You win escalating by killing players, and that's exactly terminator. But when it is about flat rate and no cards, Terminator goes in a different direction.

[OliverFA]

Well, If I have no chance of winning a terminator game, but might get some point before I go out, I'll probably go for it. But I wouldn't risk a possible win just to take someone out for their points.

Yes I know. And you will try to kill one of the weakest players (at least that is what I do). That means to things:

- The winning player is now more winning than before, as you have weakened yourself by killing one of the weakest players.
- The winning player will probably win, buy will not take many points from that, as the other players will have got the points themselves before losing.

[Bruceswar]

Agreed, Bruce. I will stretch a bit if I can gain some points, but not to the point where I leave myself open for elimination. And I certainly would never purposely thin another player out with a bad move. However, anyone that joins a terminator game should know that some players will go all out for the points against a higher rank. I mean, if a cook takes a major, that's something close to 50 points, more or less, with the cook probably losing somewhere near 10 points when he/she is eliminated. I'm sure they would consider that a swing in their favor.

The bolded statement is why higher ranks do not like terminator public games much.

[millertime13]

Yes, for the new players...they determine that an all out assault in round one is the way to play the game. As well as the suicidal urges to take Oceania when the cashes grow. Terminator or Standard, its basic escalator that boggles the majority of players, and not just low ranks. I have added more Colonels, Majors and Captains to my foe list for spectacularly bad escalator play since the medal hunt has commenced.

Attention: if you got your points and rank from noob farming or piggybacking in trips/quads, that does not mean your an escalating player.

[Sentinel XIV]

Agreed, Bruce. I will stretch a bit if I can gain some points, but not to the point where I leave myself open for elimination. And I certainly would never purposely thin another player out with a bad move. However, anyone that joins a terminator game should know that some players will go all out for the points against a higher rank. I mean, if a cook takes a major, that's something close to 50 points, more or less, with the cook probably losing somewhere near 10 points when he/she is eliminated. I'm sure they would consider that a swing in their favor.

The bolded statement is why higher ranks do not like terminator public games much.

And I completely understand why. I wouldn't want that happening to me either if I were a higher rank. So, Bruce, do you play terminator's against higher ranks?

[dcowboys055]

If you don't like the terminator style don't play it. It makes perfect sense if you're looking to increase your rank or gain points to go for a net gain in points, even if you don't "win." I'd rather gain 30 net points and not be the last one left then be the last one left and eliminate one person for 15 points.

[Timminz]

It's not bad, just different. As long as you gain points, it's a good play. You might not get as much as you could, so it might not be the best, but it's still not bad.

I totally disagree with this statement. This is why many people who are higher ranked will not play public terminator. People rank hunt and suicide you for your points. They are then swept off the board and somehow call it a success, Terrible play is more like it. Sure you might stretch a bit to make a kill, but never to the point where the next guy can sweep you off the board.

But, it is a success, if they come out with a point gain. Like Baldy said, it may not be the best play, but it is still a good one.

I won't argue your point about high ranks avoiding public terminator games. It just makes sense. A good (but not necessarily the best) play by a lower rank will cause them to lose a lot.

[lancehoch]

There are two ways of looking at success in a terminator game: winning the game and gaining points. People who play terminator to gain points will probably not transition as well to a standard game, but it is a way for them to quickly increase their rank. I know that when I drop down near 1000 points I play a few more terminator games just to bump my rank back up, but that does not mean I rank hunt. Also, high-ranking players who play terminator games cannot really complain all that much, they joined the game knowing of the possible outcomes.
I mean, if I were in a position where I could eliminate a cook or I could take out a major for a few extra armies (cards being equal) clearly I will go after the major. But if the cook had 5 cards (in an escalating game) or if it were about a 1/3 increase in armies to take out the major, I will go after the cook. Also, as a side note, even in a standard game, all things being equal, I would take out the higher ranking player, assuming they would be more able to kill me if given the chance.

[Georgerx7di]

So far I have played mostly Terminator games at CC, and sometimes I catch myself doing a not very smart movement with the excuse of killing some player to get the points.

The fact is that most times the movement that you have to do to kill a player and get the points is not the same move that you should do in order to maximize your chances to finish the game. If you kill the player and get the points, then you risk losing the game. But if you play to win, then you risk other players killing the weaker ones (even if they lose the game by doing so) and leting you almost without points even if you win the game.

The conclussion seems to be that Terminator encourages "bad" playing if you want to get the most points. Am I right?

I agree, terminator is a second rate setting, not terrible, but not great. It does entice poor players to make bad moves.

[e_i_pi]

Re: Terminator games

They are a completely different type of game to your standard. I recently got eliminated in an 8-player Circus Maximus after it got down to me and 2 other players. They were both much lower rank than me, and both attacked me. Sure, it irritated me, but I was worth 35-40 points to them, and they were worth 20 points to each other. Instead of crying foul play through secret diplomacy, I bit the bullet and realised they made the most intelligent play available. The guy who knocked me out got a 4-star rating from me (which isn't a -1 rating... I use 3 as the median). If it was a standard game, I probably would have given them both 2/3 stars for fair play.

I think so long as the players understand the purpose of the game type, and don't try to transfer standard-style or assassin-style over, then you can't fault Terminator for being non-strategic.

[Paddy The Cat]

i usually dont play much terminator, it encourages players not really to make the 'wrong' play, but it discourages them from playing to win the game... i just have that herm edwards mentality though

[jonesthecurl]

If you don't like the terminator style don't play it. It makes perfect sense if you're looking to increase your rank or gain points to go for a net gain in points, even if you don't "win." I'd rather gain 30 net points and not be the last one left then be the last one left and eliminate one person for 15 points.

yes, people often say "well, if you don't like freestyle, don't play it" for instance, and I don't and don't.
But why play terminator if the possibility of getting some points out of the game even if you're not the Last Left Standing hasn't at least crossed your mind?

[Robinette]

On topic, but with a humorous twist...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFrufPxjwX0&feature=related

[Snorri1234]

Re: Terminator games

They are a completely different type of game to your standard. I recently got eliminated in an 8-player Circus Maximus after it got down to me and 2 other players. They were both much lower rank than me, and both attacked me. Sure, it irritated me, but I was worth 35-40 points to them, and they were worth 20 points to each other. Instead of crying foul play through secret diplomacy, I bit the bullet and realised they made the most intelligent play available. The guy who knocked me out got a 4-star rating from me (which isn't a -1 rating... I use 3 as the median). If it was a standard game, I probably would have given them both 2/3 stars for fair play.

I think so long as the players understand the purpose of the game type, and don't try to transfer standard-style or assassin-style over, then you can't fault Terminator for being non-strategic.

Indeed. The strategy for Terminator is different to that of the normal setting. You don't fault people in assasin-games for trying to take out their target and ignore bonuses or other players do you?

[PLAYER57832]

It's not bad, just different. As long as you gain points, it's a good play. You might not get as much as you could, so it might not be the best, but it's still not bad.

I totally disagree with this statement. This is why many people who are higher ranked will not play public terminator. People rank hunt and suicide you for your points. They are then swept off the board and somehow call it a success, Terrible play is more like it. Sure you might stretch a bit to make a kill, but never to the point where the next guy can sweep you off the board.

But, it is a success, if they come out with a point gain. Like Baldy said, it may not be the best play, but it is still a good one.

I won't argue your point about high ranks avoiding public terminator games. It just makes sense. A good (but not necessarily the best) play by a lower rank will cause them to lose a lot.

Some high rankers avoid public games ... period. To my mind (not high ranked, of course), you either keep your points or you play. Play ANY style and eventually you will lose .. even to a cook!

Still, when it comes to Terminator or any other game type, you can't say one has strategy and another does not. They all have DIFFERANT strategies. Some maps/types are more determined by luck, others a bit more by skill ... but it is ALL strategy. Like it or leave it!