NRA Stand and Fight: We Are America

[PROFITS]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRLWF24u_Wo

[BigBallinStalin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56E8yYgLNHE

[AndyDufresne]

Plus the second amendment isn't just to protect ourselves from criminals but also tyrants, foreign and domestic. There will never be an invasion on American soil if we have the second amendment but we have to be allowed to have more than nerf guns and .22 caliber single shots.

I think American civilian citizens are a lot of great things. But I don't hold illusions that (without the full force of our military) that we could repel an invasion because we all happen to have a gun safe and some ammo.

There is more to war than having the materials.


--Andy

[patrickaa317]

Plus the second amendment isn't just to protect ourselves from criminals but also tyrants, foreign and domestic. There will never be an invasion on American soil if we have the second amendment but we have to be allowed to have more than nerf guns and .22 caliber single shots.

I think American civilian citizens are a lot of great things. But I don't hold illusions that (without the full force of our military) that we could repel an invasion because we all happen to have a gun safe and some ammo.

There is more to war than having the materials.


--Andy

I agree to some extent but if a country was looking at invading one where citizens were armed or one where they weren't, which would they prefer/choose? Do a little reading on what Guerilla warfare is... And even how it impacted the French invading the Spanish in the early 1800's. Granted war & weapons were much different then but the concept doesn't change with time.

And you are correct that there is more to war than having materials. The know-how to use them, the responsibility to use them appropriately in a safe manner, and the determination to succeed. How could the rag tag people in Afghanistan hold off the force of the Soviet Union? How has it taken 10+ years of the US fighting over there with no sight of having 0 troops stationed over there?

There's a reason why the US opted for nuclear weapons versus Japan at the end of WW2 and it was because they were afraid of a populous that was prepared to fight for it's homeland. Estimated 1.74 million casualties, 400k-800k fatalities. Read up on Operation Downfall, it was the backup plan if Japan didn't surrender as they did.

[AndyDufresne]

Granted war & weapons were much different then

You make my point pretty well.

How could the rag tag people in Afghanistan hold off the force of the Soviet Union? How has it taken 10+ years of the US fighting over there with no sight of having 0 troops stationed over there?

You seem to be oversimplifying war.

In summary,




--Andy

[patrickaa317]

Granted war & weapons were much different then

You make my point pretty well.

How could the rag tag people in Afghanistan hold off the force of the Soviet Union? How has it taken 10+ years of the US fighting over there with no sight of having 0 troops stationed over there?

You seem to be oversimplifying war.


--Andy

Not standard run of the mill warfare, self protection and preservation. I'll try to find a cartoon that explains it for you.

[Ray Rider]

Thanks to Andy's Futurama responses, I would rate this as one of the funniest debates we've had on CC!

[GeneralRisk]

Andy wins.

NRA Stand and Fight - "We want you to buy more firearms so you can indirectly line our pockets. Sensible laws be damned!"

You gonna be one of the victims? I hope it works out for you. If the 2nd amendment goes then the 1st amendment is right behind it. Then we the people are fucked. Just a educated guess.

Wait a second... there is a proposed constitutional amendment that would do away with the 2nd amendment?!?!?!

You're a fucking moron. Let me spell that out for you... f-u-c-k-i-n-g m-o-r-o-n.

This is for you and the other sheeple...hopefully this silly ass law, the dumbed down, liberal dumb fucks, protected sandy Hook with, works as well as this clip indicates...........gl

That video was clearly well researched serious news. I'd better pay attentiont to it.

Hell, Andy's Futurama clips are more informational. Sorry , I sisn't realixe u were retarded.

This is you - "AHHHH! THEY'RE GOING TO OUTLAW THE WAY CERTAIN GUNS LOOK AND MAKE SURE I CAN ONLY CARRY 20 BULLETS INSTEAD OF 120! YOU'RE VIOLATING MY SECOND AMENDMENT RIGHTS! THE WORLD IS GOING TO END! CRIMINALS WON'T BE SCARED OFF BY MY SHOTGUN/RIFLE/HAND GUN ANYMORE BECAUSE THEY WILL KNOW I WON'T HAVE PURCHASED IT FROM A GUN SHOW! WAAAH!"

That's you. YOU are the sheeple... the gun manufacturers are doing an awesome job convincing you that you'll be killed by a criminal or the government because you can't buy a gun that looks like an M-16 (nevermind that it's not actuallyM-16).

I am sorry to the CC community, as I had no idea the world has become so dumbed down and/or brainwashed. Sad indeed. Even sadder for my children. Sad that most are so fucking stupid. Mr. Greek, dig your trench and line up along side of it so your government can put you out of your misery. You are concerned about a gun manufacturer making money?? What a fucking idiot. Most anyone in the US makes money doing something. The least of my concerns is money. Money means little when dead. Mr. Greek u could be a poster child as a victim. Too bad u too dumb to profit from it.

[AndyDufresne]

Mr. Greek u could be a poster child as a victim. Too bad u too dumb to profit from it.

If you think TGD is the poster child of a victim, then that pretty much shows your understanding of the material at hand I think.

So, in summary:




--Andy

[Nola_Lifer]

Seriously? Isn't their more important things to worry about than fucking guns? We put more people in prison than any other country. Half the people that live here don't believe in evolution. We still are fighting in Afghanistan and occupying Iraq but your worried about some silly regulation. Are you gonna buy a semiautomatic wih 100+rounds?

[patrickaa317]

Seriously? Isn't their more important things to worry about than fucking guns? We put more people in prison than any other country. Half the people that live here don't believe in evolution. We still are fighting in Afghanistan and occupying Iraq but your worried about some silly regulation. Are you gonna buy a semiautomatic wih 100+rounds?

Seriously on the flipside, isn't there something more important than regulating guns? 57% of those incarcerated in US Federal prisons are related to the failed war on drugs. (Not sure what evolution has to do with anything here, seems like a random comment.) We are still fighting in Afghanistan and occupying Iraq but you are worried about getting those new silly regulations put in place? Let's stop policing the world, let's admit the war on drugs was a failure and waste of money, let's focus on getting the economy going on American soil and maintaining the strength of the dollar, not focus on whether or not someone can have a 10 round or a 20 round magazine. It's irrelevant when people cannot feed their families or find well paying jobs.

[chang50]

Seriously? Isn't their more important things to worry about than fucking guns? We put more people in prison than any other country. Half the people that live here don't believe in evolution. We still are fighting in Afghanistan and occupying Iraq but your worried about some silly regulation. Are you gonna buy a semiautomatic wih 100+rounds?

Seriously on the flipside, isn't there something more important than regulating guns? 57% of those incarcerated in US Federal prisons are related to the failed war on drugs. (Not sure what evolution has to do with anything here, seems like a random comment.) We are still fighting in Afghanistan and occupying Iraq but you are worried about getting those new silly regulations put in place? Let's stop policing the world, let's admit the war on drugs was a failure and waste of money, let's focus on getting the economy going on American soil and maintaining the strength of the dollar, not focus on whether or not someone can have a 10 round or a 20 round magazine. It's irrelevant when people cannot feed their families or find well paying jobs.

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

[patrickaa317]

Seriously? Isn't their more important things to worry about than fucking guns? We put more people in prison than any other country. Half the people that live here don't believe in evolution. We still are fighting in Afghanistan and occupying Iraq but your worried about some silly regulation. Are you gonna buy a semiautomatic wih 100+rounds?

Seriously on the flipside, isn't there something more important than regulating guns? 57% of those incarcerated in US Federal prisons are related to the failed war on drugs. (Not sure what evolution has to do with anything here, seems like a random comment.) We are still fighting in Afghanistan and occupying Iraq but you are worried about getting those new silly regulations put in place? Let's stop policing the world, let's admit the war on drugs was a failure and waste of money, let's focus on getting the economy going on American soil and maintaining the strength of the dollar, not focus on whether or not someone can have a 10 round or a 20 round magazine. It's irrelevant when people cannot feed their families or find well paying jobs.

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

I'll join you and go off-topic a little. Worldwide only 40% of people believe in evolution, so if that is your scale on education, the US is ahead of the curve. I'd tend to lean more towards mathematics, physics, and chemistry to determine level of education but that's just me. But back to evolution. Apparently between Hindus & Buddhists, their belief in evolution is over 80%, while Muslims & Christian Protestants both average out to around 45%; Catholics are just under 60%.

On a side note, while I was looking at some studies around this, I noticed that 42% of Canadians believe that humans and dinosaurs walked the earth at the same time. That's crazy.

[Ray Rider]

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

Yes it's idiotic for the US to possess the scale and number of nuclear weapons which they do, however I'm not sure why you're worried. The US has used its nuclear weapons once in nearly 70 years, and that was to end a world war. Saddam, even with the small amount of chemical weapons which we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that he possesed, used them on vast numbers of his own people! It isn't a stretch to imagine he would do the same to his enemies if given the opportunity. Secondly, if you're judging people's education based on the acceptance or nonacceptance (or simple ignorance/apathy) of evolution, I would question the intelligence of that very assertion. There are plenty of college and university programs which don't even touch on evolution (such as civil engineering, which I'm taking); you could be the most brilliant engineer in the world and be completely apathetic towards evolution.

[chang50]

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

Yes it's idiotic for the US to possess the scale and number of nuclear weapons which they do, however I'm not sure why you're worried. The US has used its nuclear weapons once in nearly 70 years, and that was to end a world war. Saddam, even with the small amount of chemical weapons which we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that he possesed, used them on vast numbers of his own people! It isn't a stretch to imagine he would do the same to his enemies if given the opportunity. Secondly, if you're judging people's education based on the acceptance or nonacceptance (or simple ignorance/apathy) of evolution, I would question the intelligence of that very assertion. There are plenty of college and university programs which don't even touch on evolution (such as civil engineering, which I'm taking); you could be the most brilliant engineer in the world and be completely apathetic towards evolution.

Apathy is widespread about most everything I was referring to the unbelievably high numbers of evolution deniers in the US.To someone raised in W.Europe this is incredible.Perhaps these people have little influence on policy makers in government,I sure hope so,but it makes you think..

[patrickaa317]

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

Yes it's idiotic for the US to possess the scale and number of nuclear weapons which they do, however I'm not sure why you're worried. The US has used its nuclear weapons once in nearly 70 years, and that was to end a world war. Saddam, even with the small amount of chemical weapons which we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that he possesed, used them on vast numbers of his own people! It isn't a stretch to imagine he would do the same to his enemies if given the opportunity. Secondly, if you're judging people's education based on the acceptance or nonacceptance (or simple ignorance/apathy) of evolution, I would question the intelligence of that very assertion. There are plenty of college and university programs which don't even touch on evolution (such as civil engineering, which I'm taking); you could be the most brilliant engineer in the world and be completely apathetic towards evolution.

Apathy is widespread about most everything I was referring to the unbelievably high numbers of evolution deniers in the US.To someone raised in W.Europe this is incredible.Perhaps these people have little influence on policy makers in government,I sure hope so,but it makes you think..

What percentage of evolution deniers are in the middle east? Does it concern you how much some of these people might influence decisions? Especially some of those that are seeking to have nuclear or biological weapons?

[john9blue]

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

is it possible that people who believe in evolution are less likely to give their lives on earth meaning?

if anything, an evolution denier is less likely to f*ck everyone over with nukes.

[chang50]

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

Yes it's idiotic for the US to possess the scale and number of nuclear weapons which they do, however I'm not sure why you're worried. The US has used its nuclear weapons once in nearly 70 years, and that was to end a world war. Saddam, even with the small amount of chemical weapons which we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that he possesed, used them on vast numbers of his own people! It isn't a stretch to imagine he would do the same to his enemies if given the opportunity. Secondly, if you're judging people's education based on the acceptance or nonacceptance (or simple ignorance/apathy) of evolution, I would question the intelligence of that very assertion. There are plenty of college and university programs which don't even touch on evolution (such as civil engineering, which I'm taking); you could be the most brilliant engineer in the world and be completely apathetic towards evolution.

Apathy is widespread about most everything I was referring to the unbelievably high numbers of evolution deniers in the US.To someone raised in W.Europe this is incredible.Perhaps these people have little influence on policy makers in government,I sure hope so,but it makes you think..

What percentage of evolution deniers are in the middle east? Does it concern you how much some of these people might influence decisions? Especially some of those that are seeking to have nuclear or biological weapons?

One Middle Eastern country in particular has had nuclear weapons for a long time and it concerns me a great deal,as they have a prominent highly vocal religious lunatic fringe and the uncritical backing of the most powerful nation on earth.

[Ray Rider]

One Middle Eastern country in particular has had nuclear weapons for a long time and it concerns me a great deal,as they have a prominent highly vocal religious lunatic fringe and the uncritical backing of the most powerful nation on earth.

I find your guys' irrational fear quite entertaining. When was the last time this nation you speak of used (or even threatened to use) their nuclear weapons? Maybe 40 years ago after a sneak attack on one of their holiest days of the year by multiple nations many time there size...can you blame them for making threats at the time given the circumstances? And since then, where are the threats? We're talking about a free, democratic, captialistic, developed, western nation here, not some dictatorship run by a mad man who routinely threatens the complete annhilation of nations. I can think of a couple of nations which fit that description, nations which would justifiably cause grave concern to the world if empowered with nuclear armaments.

[chang50]

One Middle Eastern country in particular has had nuclear weapons for a long time and it concerns me a great deal,as they have a prominent highly vocal religious lunatic fringe and the uncritical backing of the most powerful nation on earth.

I find your guys' irrational fear quite entertaining. When was the last time this nation you speak of used (or even threatened to use) their nuclear weapons? Maybe 40 years ago after a sneak attack on one of their holiest days of the year by multiple nations many time there size...can you blame them for making threats at the time given the circumstances? And since then, where are the threats? We're talking about a free, democratic, captialistic, developed, western nation here, not some dictatorship run by a mad man who routinely threatens the complete annhilation of nations. I can think of a couple of nations which fit that description, nations which would justifiably cause grave concern to the world if empowered with nuclear armaments.

At least you acknowledge Israel has nuclear weapons,illegally btw,and i know it's not much of a secret,although successive US administrations will not.Israel cannot overtly threaten to use something they are not supposed to have,but the inherent threat is in the background for all who seek justice for the dispossesed Palestinians.Look at what happened to Mordechai Vannunu..and tell me if what happened to him is acceptable in a free or democratic state.

[Baron Von PWN]

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

is it possible that people who believe in evolution are less likely to give their lives on earth meaning?

if anything, an evolution denier is less likely to f*ck everyone over with nukes.

How do you figure?


I would see belief in evolution as being neutral in that regards.

[chang50]

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

is it possible that people who believe in evolution are less likely to give their lives on earth meaning?

if anything, an evolution denier is less likely to f*ck everyone over with nukes.

How do you figure?


I would see belief in evolution as being neutral in that regards.

I gave this idea quite a bit of thought and I'm still as baffled by it as when I first read it,perhaps John can elaborate?

[john9blue]

It has to be a real cause for worry for the world that in an advanced country with WMD on the scale the US has,anywhere near half the people are so poorly educated that they don't accept evolution.So yes gun regulations appear trivial in this light,after all didn't the coalition destroy Saddam's Iraq for supposedly having WMD on a much smaller scale?And with only speculation that he might use them if they existed.

is it possible that people who believe in evolution are less likely to give their lives on earth meaning?

if anything, an evolution denier is less likely to f*ck everyone over with nukes.

How do you figure?


I would see belief in evolution as being neutral in that regards.

creationists (some kinds) believe that humans were put on this earth directly by a god.

evolutionists believe that there are probably many other intelligent species in the universe and that we are nothing special in the grand scheme of things. they are right, of course, but you can't deny that the creationist viewpoint puts much greater value on human life.

[tzor]

creationists believe that humans were put on this earth directly by a god.

evolutionists believe that there are probably many other intelligent species in the universe and that we are nothing special in the grand scheme of things. they are right, of course, but you can't deny that the creationist viewpoint puts much greater value on human life.

Pure crap and bullshit.

Creationists believe in a literal interpretation of Genesis. End of Story.

Ironically it is still possible to believe completely in evolution and to also believe in a specific creation point for man by god/aliens. It's really odd but the basic argument is that the general cannot override the specific.

The possibility of life on another planet has nothing whatsoever to do with evolution.

The best way to watch a scientist make an asshole of himself is to watch him speculate on philosophy.

[john9blue]

Pure crap and bullshit.

Creationists believe in a literal interpretation of Genesis. End of Story.

Ironically it is still possible to believe completely in evolution and to also believe in a specific creation point for man by god/aliens. It's really odd but the basic argument is that the general cannot override the specific.

The possibility of life on another planet has nothing whatsoever to do with evolution.

The best way to watch a scientist make an asshole of himself is to watch him speculate on philosophy.

so, from what i can tell, you don't understand how evolution works, and you don't understand that philosophy is a science.

also, i know quite a few people who believe in god and evolution, so you don't need to inform me that they are not mutually exclusive (with your pathetic argument about some remote minority with odd beliefs). what's especially funny is that you claim all creationists take genesis literally, when genesis says nothing about any "aliens" that you claim some creationists believe in.

write a post that actually addresses my argument, and isn't full of irrelevant, self-contradictory shit, and then i can take you seriously.