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Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidates

Postby Gillipig on Tue Feb 25, 2014 5:19 pm

in the 2016 election?
Okay so obviosuly I do not follow american politics very much, but I did a little research and found two popular names.
Hillary Clinton and Jeb Bush. My first thought when I saw the name Jeb Bush was... can he possibly be related to.....nah...Bush is a common name.....there are probably hundreds of thousands of americans with that name......they can't all be related to the two previous presidents named Bush.......can he?....Holy fucking shit he is! It's George W. Bush's brother! You have to be fucking joking with me!!
Seriously, if you like family dynasties so much why did you break free from Britain in the first place? Who cares if it's Henry the 15'th of house Lancaster, or if it's George the 13th Bush of house Texas that rules your country? It's bizzare! And Hillary everyone knows is Clinton's wife, Al Gore was the son of a Senator and then you have the Roosevelt's...It's insane. Is this americans idea of a functioning democracy? That everyone in politics should be related to each other? It reminds me more of the feudal kingdoms of Europe.
AoG for President of the World!!
I promise he will put George W. Bush to shame!
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby saxitoxin on Tue Feb 25, 2014 5:31 pm

+500 SxBucks, G!

And this is the second time in a month I've referenced C. Wright Mills in a post here on the Conquer Club ...

According to Mills, the eponymous "power elite" are those that occupy the dominant positions, in the dominant institutions (military, economic and political) of a dominant country, and their decisions (or lack of decisions) have enormous consequences, not only for the U.S. population but, "the underlying populations of the world." The institutions which they head, Mills posits, are a triumvirate of groups that have succeeded weaker predecessors: (1) "two or three hundred giant corporations" which have replaced the traditional agrarian and craft economy, (2) a strong federal political order that has inherited power from "a decentralized set of several dozen states" and "now enters into each and every crany of the social structure," and (3) the military establishment, formerly an object of "distrust fed by state militia," but now an entity with "all the grim and clumsy efficiency of a sprawling bureaucratic domain."

Importantly, and in distinction from modern American conspiracy theory, Mills explains that the elite themselves may not be aware of their status as an elite, noting that "often they are uncertain about their roles" and "without conscious effort, they absorb the aspiration to be ... The Ones Who Decide." Nonetheless, he sees them as a quasi-hereditary caste. The members of the "power elite," according to Mills, often enter into positions of societal prominence through educations obtained at eastern establishment universities like Harvard, Princeton, and Yale. But, Mills notes, "Harvard or Yale or Princeton is not enough ... the point is not Harvard, but which Harvard?" Mills identifies two classes of Ivy League alumni, those initiated into an upper echelon fraternity or final club, such as Porcellian and Fly Club, and those who are not. Those so initiated, Mills continues, receive their invitations based on social links first established in elite private preparatory academies, where they are enrolled as part of antebellum family traditions. In this manner, the mantle of the elite generally passes through families.

The resulting elites, who control the three dominant institutions (military, economic and political) can be generally grouped into one of six types, according to Mills:
- the "Metropolitan 400" - members of historically notable local families in the principal American cities, generally represented on the Social Register
- "Celebrities" - prominent entertainers and media personalities
- the "Chief Executives" - presidents and CEO's of the most important companies within each industrial sector
- the "Corporate Rich" - major landowners and corporate shareholders
- the "Warlords" - senior military officers, most importantly the Joint Chiefs of Staff
- the "Political Directorate" - "fifty-odd men of the executive branch" of the U.S. federal government, including the senior leadership in the Executive Office of the President, sometimes variously drawn from elected officials of the Democratic and Republican parties but usually professional government bureaucrats

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Power_Elite
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=241668&start=200#p5349880
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:52 pm

Jeb Bush is the one-party's choice, whereas it doesn't matter if Clinton or Bush wins, they share power and nothing will change.

On the other hand, when you look at Conservative polling rather than mainstream, you get this

1. Texas Sen. Ted Cruz-84 percent.
2. Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul-80 percent.
3. Dr. Ben Carson-77 percent.
4. Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker-70 percent.
5. Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin-64 percent.
19. New Hampshire Sen. Kelly Ayotte-30 percent.
20. Former Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman Jr.-29 percent.
21. Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush-29 percent.
22. New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie-15 percent.

Sens. Ted Cruz (R-TX) and Rand Paul (R-KY) lead an online Tea Party presidential poll while Republican New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie comes in dead last.
Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush is second to last with former Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman, the failed 2012 GOP presidential candidate who is now associated with the conservative-bashing "No Labels" group that is a refuge for those in the bipartisan permanent political class. The Washington Examiner reported that grassroots conservatives also strongly support Dr. Ben Carson, former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker.
Cruz has the support of 84% of those polled online. Paul got the support of 80%. Christie got the support of 15% while Bush and Huntsman received 29% each.
It should be noted that the online poll of 62,000 activists for TheTeaParty.net and the conservative group Contract from America is not scientific, but it nonetheless gives a good snapshot of the sentiment of Tea Party activists
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby Phatscotty on Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:52 pm

hate my keyboard sometimes
Last edited by Phatscotty on Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:35 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby BigBallinStalin on Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:57 pm

Jeb Bush is the one-party's choice, whereas it doesn't matter if Clinton or Bush wins, they share power and nothing will change.

On the other hand, when you look at Conservative polling rather than mainstream, you get this

1. Texas Sen. Ted Cruz-84 percent.
2. Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul-80 percent.
3. Dr. Ben Carson-77 percent.
4. Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker-70 percent.
5. Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin-64 percent.
19. New Hampshire Sen. Kelly Ayotte-30 percent.
20. Former Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman Jr.-29 percent.
21. Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush-29 percent.
22. New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie-15 percent.

Sens. Ted Cruz (R-TX) and Rand Paul (R-KY) lead an online Tea Party presidential poll while Republican New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie comes in dead last.
Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush is second to last with former Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman, the failed 2012 GOP presidential candidate who is now associated with the conservative-bashing "No Labels" group that is a refuge for those in the bipartisan permanent political class. The Washington Examiner reported that grassroots conservatives also strongly support Dr. Ben Carson, former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker.
Cruz has the support of 84% of those polled online. Paul got the support of 80%. Christie got the support of 15% while Bush and Huntsman received 29% each.
It should be noted that the online poll of 62,000 activists for TheTeaParty.net and the conservative group Contract from America is not scientific, but it nonetheless gives a good snapshot of the sentiment of Tea Party activists
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby saxitoxin on Tue Feb 25, 2014 11:01 pm

Does anyone happen to know who the one-party's choice is and if it will matter if Clinton or Bush wins?
Pack Rat wrote:if it quacks like a duck and walk like a duck, it's still fascism

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=241668&start=200#p5349880
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby ChrisPond on Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:19 am

Phatscotty wrote:Jeb Bush is the one-party's choice, whereas it doesn't matter if Clinton or Bush wins, they share power and nothing will change.

On the other hand, when you look at Conservative polling rather than mainstream, you get this

1. Texas Sen. Ted Cruz-84 percent.
2. Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul-80 percent.
3. Dr. Ben Carson-77 percent.
4. Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker-70 percent.
5. Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin-64 percent.
19. New Hampshire Sen. Kelly Ayotte-30 percent.
20. Former Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman Jr.-29 percent.
21. Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush-29 percent.
22. New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie-15 percent.

Sens. Ted Cruz (R-TX) and Rand Paul (R-KY) lead an online Tea Party presidential poll while Republican New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie comes in dead last.
Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush is second to last with former Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman, the failed 2012 GOP presidential candidate who is now associated with the conservative-bashing "No Labels" group that is a refuge for those in the bipartisan permanent political class. The Washington Examiner reported that grassroots conservatives also strongly support Dr. Ben Carson, former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker.
Cruz has the support of 84% of those polled online. Paul got the support of 80%. Christie got the support of 15% while Bush and Huntsman received 29% each.
It should be noted that the online poll of 62,000 activists for TheTeaParty.net and the conservative group Contract from America is not scientific, but it nonetheless gives a good snapshot of the sentiment of Tea Party activists


i have to admit i am a registered republican that typically votes for the libertarian canidate (i have voted in the presidential election 4 times and i have voted libertarian 3 times). i am also not a gambling man but i think i would bet that someone like Jeb bush or chris christie ends up as the nominee..pushing me to vote libertarian again (not that i have any problem with that as i liek it over there). you want proof of this prediction? the establishment GOP has given us Bush, McClain , and Romney the last 4 elections to vote for. no way the GOP puts up someone that is for small government...main stream republicans and democrats....not much difference to me. once the Amercian voting population figures that out, the game is over.
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby Phatscotty on Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:36 am

saxitoxin wrote:Does anyone happen to know who the one-party's choice is and if it will matter if Clinton or Bush wins?


The IIRC always wins Saxi
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby Dukasaur on Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:46 am

From a purely grammatical point of view, I'm not sure if the question works, as a question.

Other than that, your puzzlement is shared by much of the world. One would think that Americans would not a third time elect the representative of a family which already twice has gotten them embroiled in a pointless Mid-east war to enforce Saudi Arabia's hegemony, costing countless billions of dollars and thousands of American lives (Not to mention hundreds of thousands of non-American lives! I know those are a lot cheaper but they still need to be factored in at some point.)

I guess the only real explanation is that Americans now have too much wealth. They feel that if they don't convert it to Tomahawk missiles and send them to explode somewhere in Arabia that there will be a period of decadence and complacency setting in at home.

Or maybe they are just sick and tired of seeing those cheap prices at the gas pump. They want to once again bomb some oil-producing nation so that the spot price of oil skyrockets and some decent profits start flowing into Exxon-Mobil's bank account.
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby Phatscotty on Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:53 am

ChrisPond wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Jeb Bush is the one-party's choice, whereas it doesn't matter if Clinton or Bush wins, they share power and nothing will change.

On the other hand, when you look at Conservative polling rather than mainstream, you get this

1. Texas Sen. Ted Cruz-84 percent.
2. Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul-80 percent.
3. Dr. Ben Carson-77 percent.
4. Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker-70 percent.
5. Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin-64 percent.
19. New Hampshire Sen. Kelly Ayotte-30 percent.
20. Former Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman Jr.-29 percent.
21. Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush-29 percent.
22. New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie-15 percent.

Sens. Ted Cruz (R-TX) and Rand Paul (R-KY) lead an online Tea Party presidential poll while Republican New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie comes in dead last.
Former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush is second to last with former Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman, the failed 2012 GOP presidential candidate who is now associated with the conservative-bashing "No Labels" group that is a refuge for those in the bipartisan permanent political class. The Washington Examiner reported that grassroots conservatives also strongly support Dr. Ben Carson, former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker.
Cruz has the support of 84% of those polled online. Paul got the support of 80%. Christie got the support of 15% while Bush and Huntsman received 29% each.
It should be noted that the online poll of 62,000 activists for TheTeaParty.net and the conservative group Contract from America is not scientific, but it nonetheless gives a good snapshot of the sentiment of Tea Party activists



i have to admit i am a registered republican that typically votes for the libertarian canidate (i have voted in the presidential election 4 times and i have voted libertarian 3 times). i am also not a gambling man but i think i would bet that someone like Jeb bush or chris christie ends up as the nominee..pushing me to vote libertarian again (not that i have any problem with that as i liek it over there). you want proof of this prediction? the establishment GOP has given us Bush, McClain , and Romney the last 4 elections to vote for. no way the GOP puts up someone that is for small government...main stream republicans and democrats....not much difference to me. once the Amercian voting population figures that out, the game is over.


I think Rand Paul has a GREAT shot


Remember, Bush, Mccain, Romney, that was all before the Libertarian -Conservative-Independent revolution merged and solidified. The 'compassionate Conservative' wave is over. In 2012 the rebels took their position in state and local governments and their policies are systemic and recently they have begun laying the groundwork to get one of their candidates nominated for a major presidential and Congressional candidacy's all across the country. There has been a battle for the soul of the GOP going on the last few years, and the one's who have pushed Liberty and Conservative fiscal policy are still there, and the neo-con progressive nation building overspending Republican types have been/are being cast out as the GOP are holding themselves accountable and actually attempting to pull off standing for what they believe in and being rewarded for doing so.

It took them a lot of time and energy and money and blood, sweat and tears to get the Campaign for Liberty up and running, and the stage is set for the new blood in the GOP to transform the party and beat the system at it's own game. If the DFL would start holding themselves accountable and start shaping up, this country could actually start getting things done.
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby macbone on Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:07 am

I read Gifted Hands back when I was a young pre-med student (oh god what happened to me?), and I was really impressed then with Ben Carson. He won't win the Republican nomination, but I'd vote for him in a heartbeat if he runs. I'm really surprised to see his name up there.
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby Dukasaur on Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:09 am

Phatscotty wrote:Remember, Bush, Mccain, Romney, that was all before the Libertarian -Conservative-Independent revolution merged and solidified. The 'compassionate Conservative' wave is over. In 2012 the rebels took their position in state and local governments and their policies are systemic and recently they have begun laying the groundwork to get one of their candidates nominated for a major presidential and Congressional candidacy's all across the country. There has been a battle for the soul of the GOP going on the last few years, and the one's who have pushed Liberty and Conservative fiscal policy are still there, and the neo-con progressive nation building overspending Republican types have been/are being cast out as the GOP are holding themselves accountable and actually attempting to pull off standing for what they believe in and being rewarded for doing so.

It took them a lot of time and energy and money and blood, sweat and tears to get the Campaign for Liberty up and running, and the stage is set for the new blood in the GOP to transform the party and beat the system at it's own game. If the DFL would start holding themselves accountable and start shaping up, this country could actually start getting things done.

Oh, for god's sakes please grow up and stop being such a naive little child.

Listen to the last 40 seconds of this video that you yourself posted:
Subject: Republican National Convention:Votes and Rules Reality Check

Phatscotty wrote:
Here is a follow up video


Or listen to some reality, for once:
Subject: iSideWith.com

Dukasaur wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:However, I've cast my lot for the time being with Libertarians highjacking the Republican Party. That is a much more realistic battle to fight IMO.


This and future hijackings averted. The SWAT team has stormed the plane. Situation in Tampa reported normal. Alpha Team Leader Romney reports all remaining Paul forces neutralized. Mop-up actions commencing.

Several members of the Maine delegation walked out of the Tampa Bay Times Forum after the convention affirmed the GOP’s decision to replace 10 of Maine’s 24 delegates.

... the decision to not seat the original Maine delegation, and the approval of rules that will make it harder for grass-roots-fueled candidates in the future, caused an uproar in the handful of state delegations dominated by Paul supporters, as well as some others that are concerned about the GOP centralizing power in the hands of a few and taking it away from the states.

Wiselot Rouzard, a delegate from Nevada and a Paul supporter, compared the situation to Adolf Hitler taking power in Germany.

“There’s nothing American about what just happened,” he said. “This is the death of the Republican Party.”

As the roll call of states commenced, several states listed votes for both Romney and Paul. When repeating back the count, those at the podium cited only the Romney votes.

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la ... Stories%29


LMAO:

    As the roll call of states commenced, several states listed votes for both Romney and Paul. When repeating back the count, those at the podium cited only the Romney votes.


viewtopic.php?f=8&t=177477#p3875004

The fight continues


How does it feel being a sucker? Libertarian, my ass.

It's just so, so, terribly sad. For seventy years this charade has gone on, and still the libertarians fall for it. The Republicans pepper their rhetoric with a few libertarian-sounding phrases, and the libertarians, desperate to climb out of obscurity, come running like pet dogs from the back yard.

f*ck it really makes me want to cry.

For seventy years Republicans have talked about cutting back the size of government, reducing taxes, cutting red tape, getting the government out of people's lives, and all the things that libertarians love to hear. None of them has actually done so, but that doesn't stop the next one from talking about it and reeling in some more fish, so certain that it will be different this time.

Deal with reality as it is, not as you wish it would be!!!

"Against man's stupidity, the gods themselves contend in vain."


In seventy years, no Republican administrations has overseen any meaningful reduction in the size and scope of government. In that time, you've seen habeas corpus become a quaint memory, the First, Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Amendments almost totally dismantled in the name of national security (even while obsessively defending the Second Amendment, as if its preservation should somehow make up for the loss of the others) and your nation gradually descend into a police state. No Republican administration has overseen a net reduction in taxes; highly publicized tax cuts for the rich notwithstanding. No Republican administration has overseen a net reduction in the Federal bureaucracy or the total number of federal regulations. (The much-demonized Democrat Jimmy Carter is the only one who managed that feat.) No Republican administration has overseen a reduction in the debt, despite ceaseless babble about fiscal responsibility.

The closest any of them came was Ronald Reagan, and you saw how quickly he was neutered. He was forced to accept a mainline big-government Repocrat as Vice-President. All the libertarians he appointed during his first term either were forced to resign or simply gave up the hopeless fight and resigned on their own. He didn't make the mistake of appointing any libertarians in his second term. His highly-publicized promise to disband the Department of Education and return control of education to the states was the first promise tossed in the trashcan -- he was forced to appoint a mainline Repocrat as Secretary of Education and within eight months the Department's budget was increased.

And all this time the same tired bullshit about how this time it's different. Yeah, okay.

I'm sorry. I'm not saying these things to be hurtful. Despite the stupid shit you say, I really do like you on some level, and I don't want to see you once again led down the garden path and betrayed at the end of it. When the next Republican president once again raises taxes, sends your children off to die in some desert shithole for the sole purpose of raising oil prices, and creates yet another federal security agency to kick down your doors and/or stop and frisk you or your neighbours without a warrant, I really will NOT enjoy saying "I told you so."
“‎Life is a shipwreck, but we must not forget to sing in the lifeboats.”
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby TA1LGUNN3R on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:05 am

Someone ate their Taco Bell waffle tacos for breakfast this morning.

-TG
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby Gillipig on Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:19 am

Dukasaur wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Remember, Bush, Mccain, Romney, that was all before the Libertarian -Conservative-Independent revolution merged and solidified. The 'compassionate Conservative' wave is over. In 2012 the rebels took their position in state and local governments and their policies are systemic and recently they have begun laying the groundwork to get one of their candidates nominated for a major presidential and Congressional candidacy's all across the country. There has been a battle for the soul of the GOP going on the last few years, and the one's who have pushed Liberty and Conservative fiscal policy are still there, and the neo-con progressive nation building overspending Republican types have been/are being cast out as the GOP are holding themselves accountable and actually attempting to pull off standing for what they believe in and being rewarded for doing so.

It took them a lot of time and energy and money and blood, sweat and tears to get the Campaign for Liberty up and running, and the stage is set for the new blood in the GOP to transform the party and beat the system at it's own game. If the DFL would start holding themselves accountable and start shaping up, this country could actually start getting things done.

Oh, for god's sakes please grow up and stop being such a naive little child.

Listen to the last 40 seconds of this video that you yourself posted:
Subject: Republican National Convention:Votes and Rules Reality Check


Dukasaur wrote:
Woodruff wrote:It's just so, so, terribly sad. For seventy years this charade has gone on, and still the libertarians fall for it. The Republicans pepper their rhetoric with a few libertarian-sounding phrases, and the libertarians, desperate to climb out of obscurity, come running like pet dogs from the back yard.

f*ck it really makes me want to cry.

For seventy years Republicans have talked about cutting back the size of government, reducing taxes, cutting red tape, getting the government out of people's lives, and all the things that libertarians love to hear. None of them has actually done so, but that doesn't stop the next one from talking about it and reeling in some more fish, so certain that it will be different this time.

Deal with reality as it is, not as you wish it would be!!!

"Against man's stupidity, the gods themselves contend in vain."


In seventy years, no Republican administrations has overseen any meaningful reduction in the size and scope of government. In that time, you've seen habeas corpus become a quaint memory, the First, Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Amendments almost totally dismantled in the name of national security (even while obsessively defending the Second Amendment, as if its preservation should somehow make up for the loss of the others) and your nation gradually descend into a police state. No Republican administration has overseen a net reduction in taxes; highly publicized tax cuts for the rich notwithstanding. No Republican administration has overseen a net reduction in the Federal bureaucracy or the total number of federal regulations. (The much-demonized Democrat Jimmy Carter is the only one who managed that feat.) No Republican administration has overseen a reduction in the debt, despite ceaseless babble about fiscal responsibility.

The closest any of them came was Ronald Reagan, and you saw how quickly he was neutered. He was forced to accept a mainline big-government Repocrat as Vice-President. All the libertarians he appointed during his first term either were forced to resign or simply gave up the hopeless fight and resigned on their own. He didn't make the mistake of appointing any libertarians in his second term. His highly-publicized promise to disband the Department of Education and return control of education to the states was the first promise tossed in the trashcan -- he was forced to appoint a mainline Repocrat as Secretary of Education and within eight months the Department's budget was increased.

And all this time the same tired bullshit about how this time it's different. Yeah, okay.

I'm sorry. I'm not saying these things to be hurtful. Despite the stupid shit you say, I really do like you on some level, and I don't want to see you once again led down the garden path and betrayed at the end of it. When the next Republican president once again raises taxes, sends your children off to die in some desert shithole for the sole purpose of raising oil prices, and creates yet another federal security agency to kick down your doors and/or stop and frisk you or your neighbours without a warrant, I really will NOT enjoy saying "I told you so."


One of the key problems with democracy as a whole is that politicians make promises they don't keep. When this becomes common in politics democracy stops working. They're elected because of what they promise to do, they shouldn't be able to get away with not fullfilling their promises. If they don't think they can do something they shouldn't promise it. And if it isn't up for them to decide and they're dependent on the senate to pass the bill, promising that it will get done is either the signs of visions of grandeur or blatant disrespect towards the people. (they're so stupid they don't realise this isn't up for us to decide)
If politicians ony promised what they could keep there would be a lot less promises, and if they changed their rethoric to "This is what I will aim/attempt to do." instead of "This is what I will do!" people wouldn't feel cheated if they didn't deliver. Never trust a politician who pretends that being elected into office means becoming an absolut monarch. This usually translates into "don't trust any politician" as most of them make promises they can't possibly see through themselves. A great dose of humility and honesty is needed in politics, but it isn't humility and honesty that gets you votes. Extreme levels of confidence makes people think a politician is more likely to get things done, when what it really is a sign of is either ignorance of the political system or dishonesty towards the people. Honesty is not appreciated as the truth unfortunately is not as appealing as lies. How many votes do you think a politician would get by saying "This won't be up for me to decide but I will attempt to convince the house of representatives to do this."? Not many, he'd probably lose a ton of them, boldly procliaming that you will get this law passed sounds much more appealing unfortunately. And thus people will continue to be fed these lies. With the way they're voting they're basically asking politicians to lie to them. It of course doesn't justify the lies but it does explain why they do it over and over again.
AoG for President of the World!!
I promise he will put George W. Bush to shame!
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Re: Who does Republicans and Democrats see as their candidat

Postby BigBallinStalin on Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:43 am

Dukasaur wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:Remember, Bush, Mccain, Romney, that was all before the Libertarian -Conservative-Independent revolution merged and solidified. The 'compassionate Conservative' wave is over. In 2012 the rebels took their position in state and local governments and their policies are systemic and recently they have begun laying the groundwork to get one of their candidates nominated for a major presidential and Congressional candidacy's all across the country. There has been a battle for the soul of the GOP going on the last few years, and the one's who have pushed Liberty and Conservative fiscal policy are still there, and the neo-con progressive nation building overspending Republican types have been/are being cast out as the GOP are holding themselves accountable and actually attempting to pull off standing for what they believe in and being rewarded for doing so.

It took them a lot of time and energy and money and blood, sweat and tears to get the Campaign for Liberty up and running, and the stage is set for the new blood in the GOP to transform the party and beat the system at it's own game. If the DFL would start holding themselves accountable and start shaping up, this country could actually start getting things done.

Oh, for god's sakes please grow up and stop being such a naive little child.

Listen to the last 40 seconds of this video that you yourself posted:
Subject: Republican National Convention:Votes and Rules Reality Check

Phatscotty wrote:
Here is a follow up video


Or listen to some reality, for once:
Subject: iSideWith.com

Dukasaur wrote:
Woodruff wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
Phatscotty wrote:However, I've cast my lot for the time being with Libertarians highjacking the Republican Party. That is a much more realistic battle to fight IMO.


This and future hijackings averted. The SWAT team has stormed the plane. Situation in Tampa reported normal. Alpha Team Leader Romney reports all remaining Paul forces neutralized. Mop-up actions commencing.

Several members of the Maine delegation walked out of the Tampa Bay Times Forum after the convention affirmed the GOP’s decision to replace 10 of Maine’s 24 delegates.

... the decision to not seat the original Maine delegation, and the approval of rules that will make it harder for grass-roots-fueled candidates in the future, caused an uproar in the handful of state delegations dominated by Paul supporters, as well as some others that are concerned about the GOP centralizing power in the hands of a few and taking it away from the states.

Wiselot Rouzard, a delegate from Nevada and a Paul supporter, compared the situation to Adolf Hitler taking power in Germany.

“There’s nothing American about what just happened,” he said. “This is the death of the Republican Party.”

As the roll call of states commenced, several states listed votes for both Romney and Paul. When repeating back the count, those at the podium cited only the Romney votes.

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la ... Stories%29


LMAO:

    As the roll call of states commenced, several states listed votes for both Romney and Paul. When repeating back the count, those at the podium cited only the Romney votes.


viewtopic.php?f=8&t=177477#p3875004

The fight continues


How does it feel being a sucker? Libertarian, my ass.

It's just so, so, terribly sad. For seventy years this charade has gone on, and still the libertarians fall for it. The Republicans pepper their rhetoric with a few libertarian-sounding phrases, and the libertarians, desperate to climb out of obscurity, come running like pet dogs from the back yard.

f*ck it really makes me want to cry.

For seventy years Republicans have talked about cutting back the size of government, reducing taxes, cutting red tape, getting the government out of people's lives, and all the things that libertarians love to hear. None of them has actually done so, but that doesn't stop the next one from talking about it and reeling in some more fish, so certain that it will be different this time.

Deal with reality as it is, not as you wish it would be!!!

"Against man's stupidity, the gods themselves contend in vain."


In seventy years, no Republican administrations has overseen any meaningful reduction in the size and scope of government. In that time, you've seen habeas corpus become a quaint memory, the First, Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Amendments almost totally dismantled in the name of national security (even while obsessively defending the Second Amendment, as if its preservation should somehow make up for the loss of the others) and your nation gradually descend into a police state. No Republican administration has overseen a net reduction in taxes; highly publicized tax cuts for the rich notwithstanding. No Republican administration has overseen a net reduction in the Federal bureaucracy or the total number of federal regulations. (The much-demonized Democrat Jimmy Carter is the only one who managed that feat.) No Republican administration has overseen a reduction in the debt, despite ceaseless babble about fiscal responsibility.

The closest any of them came was Ronald Reagan, and you saw how quickly he was neutered. He was forced to accept a mainline big-government Repocrat as Vice-President. All the libertarians he appointed during his first term either were forced to resign or simply gave up the hopeless fight and resigned on their own. He didn't make the mistake of appointing any libertarians in his second term. His highly-publicized promise to disband the Department of Education and return control of education to the states was the first promise tossed in the trashcan -- he was forced to appoint a mainline Repocrat as Secretary of Education and within eight months the Department's budget was increased.

And all this time the same tired bullshit about how this time it's different. Yeah, okay.

I'm sorry. I'm not saying these things to be hurtful. Despite the stupid shit you say, I really do like you on some level, and I don't want to see you once again led down the garden path and betrayed at the end of it. When the next Republican president once again raises taxes, sends your children off to die in some desert shithole for the sole purpose of raising oil prices, and creates yet another federal security agency to kick down your doors and/or stop and frisk you or your neighbours without a warrant, I really will NOT enjoy saying "I told you so."



DUKASAUR WINS!!!
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