Coming Messiah

[AndyDufresne]

There is a bit of bigotry emanating from this thread, and it ain't coming from UC.......

--Andy

[Lord Arioch]

I dont belive in god, i belive in letting people belive in whatever they want!
But the earths been around a while... so which religion are right... jews, christians, muslims, that fat lady we worshipped in the really olden days... norse myth?
Christianity is pretty young if u compare it to hinduism... its impossible to say what is right and wrong when discussing these things. The fun part is discussing them, learning stuff and respecting other peoples views... even if they are right, or wrong cause face it no one here is going to change their opinion? if that means i go to heaven... well fun and fine, if that means i go to hell well i will cope there 2. If it means i end up i valhall well im no good with the axe! but i love meat and mead... so i will fit there 2

[Lord Arioch]

Im not an american... but do u folks really belive that Columbus "discovered" the Americas? Not the viking Leif Eriksson? Or more likely... the people already living there? This is most strange:)

[Symmetry]

Im not an american... but do u folks really belive that Columbus "discovered" the Americas? Not the viking Leif Eriksson? Or more likely... the people already living there? This is most strange:)

Of course he did. The fact that other people discovered it earlier doesn't mean he didn't find it.

[macbone]

No way, Olaf the Blue got to Newfoundland first. =)

Click image to enlarge.

[universalchiro]

@Patches: there are several definitions of the word generation. One is production, another is step of family such as parent to child, another is the entire life span of people born close in time. Such as the "baby boomers". They are a generation still existing born after WW2.

So when Jesus said "when you see all these things, recognize that it is near, at the door. Truly I say to you, this generation (the ones born just prior to the start (Israel becoming a nation 1948) will not pass away until all these things take place."

There is harmony with dictionary definitions and Bible prophecies.

[Army of GOD]

(the ones born just prior to the start (Israel becoming a nation 1948) will not pass away until all these things take place."

-compile error: ) expected

[patches70]

@Patches: there are several definitions of the word generation. One is production, another is step of family such as parent to child, another is the entire life span of people born close in time. Such as the "baby boomers". They are a generation still existing born after WW2.

So when Jesus said "when you see all these things, recognize that it is near, at the door. Truly I say to you, this generation (the ones born just prior to the start (Israel becoming a nation 1948) will not pass away until all these things take place."

There is harmony with dictionary definitions and Bible prophecies.

With due respect, UC, trying to get people to repent because The End is nigh is not the right line to go, IMO.

Jesus said a lot of other things, things much much more important. By focusing on The End Times is tantamount to coercion, as in- "If you don't do what <insert Authority figure> says then you will be <insert ghastly punishment>". That is by all definitions, coercion.

It's not the line Jesus used, it's not the line followers of Jesus should use, IMO.

Not just because it's coercion, which is an abomination to me, but it's also harmful to the true message. For instance, if in thirty years, what you say has not come to pass, then you have shown yourself to be incorrect, which then translates into "what else was he wrong about?".

It's like putting all your eggs into one basket when the basket you are putting them in wasn't really the point of what Jesus taught anyway.

Even the Atheists and religion haters in this thread would be hard pressed to actually disagree with anything that Jesus taught. They may have disagreements about what the apostles taught, but the words and teachings attributed to Jesus is pure wisdom and benign.
Even those who espouse zero belief in God still tend to strive to achieve the things Jesus taught, whether they realize, admit or understand.

To me that's the line one should be taking, instead of attempting to discern the future which is problematic for us mere mortals. Jesus, on the other hand, is pretty straight forward and brought a message that all but the most evil could actually argue against.

Just my thoughts, man. Do as you will, for myself, I don't pretend to completely understand what is going to happen in The End Times. If you think you do, then best of luck trying to convince others. Hell, you might be right, you might have interpreted everything perfectly. Me, I'm not that good at such things.

[universalchiro]

@Patches: I hear ya and agree there is no conversion from pressure scare tactics. That's not my intent hear, but admittedly there is no way around appearing that way. My intent is to show that something supernatural is occurring before our eyes as the Bible foretold. My goal is for someone to look at the list of fulfilled prophecies and say maybe there is something special about the God of the Bible and something special about this Bible and read for themselves.

But I'm with you, no one believes via pressure, only God through the gospel message that Jesus paid for all sins on the cross to those who believe unto eternal life, converts the soul.

[Symmetry]

@Patches: I hear ya and agree there is no conversion from pressure scare tactics. That's not my intent hear, but admittedly there is no way around appearing that way. My intent is to show that something supernatural is occurring before our eyes as the Bible foretold. My goal is for someone to look at the list of fulfilled prophecies and say maybe there is something special about the God of the Bible and something special about this Bible and read for themselves.

But I'm with you, no one believes via pressure, only God through the gospel message that Jesus paid for all sins on the cross to those who believe unto eternal life, converts the soul.

Which is your preferred Bible? The one you consider most accurate?

[chang50]

@Patches: I hear ya and agree there is no conversion from pressure scare tactics. That's not my intent hear, but admittedly there is no way around appearing that way. My intent is to show that something supernatural is occurring before our eyes as the Bible foretold. My goal is for someone to look at the list of fulfilled prophecies and say maybe there is something special about the God of the Bible and something special about this Bible and read for themselves.

But I'm with you, no one believes via pressure, only God through the gospel message that Jesus paid for all sins on the cross to those who believe unto eternal life, converts the soul.

Very reasonable..but personally even if the evidence forced me to accept your God and bible prophecies as demonstrable fact,I still would not go any further and accept JC as my saviour.You will never understand this but it's a self-respect thing for me,honestly..not teasing you.

[universalchiro]

@Symmetry: I think you or someone already asked this several pages back. There are many great versions that say the same concept with varying synonyms. My favorites are:
New King James, New American Standard & New International version. Whatever the vernacular, each version is compared and measured to manuscripts 2,300 hundreds years old to 1,700 years old for accuracy.

@Chang: I hear ya about the respect thing, but I challenge you to study these recent fulfilled prophecies and if you feel the odds of occurance is getting slimmer and slimmer with each one fulfilled, then read the Bible on your own. I mean think about it, Israel is not a nation for 2,500 years and all of a sudden after breaking 2,000 years of silence , prophecies are being fulfilled.

[Symmetry]

@Symmetry: I think you or someone already asked this several pages back. There are many great versions that say the same concept with varying synonyms. My favorites are:
New King James, New American Standard & New International version. Whatever the vernacular, each version is compared and measured to manuscripts 2,300 hundreds years old to 1,700 years old for accuracy.

@Chang: I hear ya about the respect thing, but I challenge you to study these recent fulfilled prophecies and if you feel the odds of occurance is getting slimmer and slimmer with each one fulfilled, then read the Bible on your own. I mean think about it, Israel is not a nation for 2,500 years and all of a sudden after breaking 2,000 years of silence , prophecies are being fulfilled.

Do you have a favourite? And if so, why?

[Army of GOD]

#atheists1christians0

[TA1LGUNN3R]

And those UC bashers, you like to preach tolerance, say you are against bigotry and such. UC is merely doing what his faith dictates he is supposed to do. He is not harming anyone at all, but considering some of the reactions from you people you'd think UC must have sneaked into your house and murdered your families and raped the family pet.

I don't hate him. In fact, he provides much amusement. I just think he's super silly. He shouldn't get upset when I mock his inane beliefs just like I don't get upset when he says I'll burn in hell. In addition, in the same way that a rational person doesn't engage with a flat-earther, I think his anti-evolutionary assertions are likewise stupid, and honestly they are deserving of mockery when and if he wishes to advocate creationism. The same goes for his prophecies. It's kinda the whole "if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen" thing.

Religions are used to target marks. Either UC is a pro-troll or a grade-A mark.

-TG

[universalchiro]

@Symmetry: I read the NKJV first so I enjoy the poetry, I've read the NIV and English Standard Versionand appreciate the alternate synonyms that gives me a better understanding, but for closest to oldest manuscript I prefer the American Standard version. For example: if the oldest manuscript read lend your ear to me, the NASV would say lend your ear to me, figuring the reader will understand authorial intent. : where the NIV reads listen closely to my words, . So I like NASV thinking its closest to original, though they both have same meaning.

[Symmetry]

@Symmetry: I read the NKJV first so I enjoy the poetry, I've read the NIV and English Standard Versionand appreciate the alternate synonyms that gives me a better understanding, but for closest to oldest manuscript I prefer the American Standard version. For example: if the oldest manuscript read lend your ear to me, the NASV would say lend your ear to me, figuring the reader will understand authorial intent. : where the NIV reads listen closely to my words, . So I like NASV thinking its closest to original, though they both have same meaning.

Which one has the best prophecies? The most literal?

[universalchiro]

@Symmetry: best prophecies? They're all the same. Most accurate: IMO NASV is the closest to original manuscript copies.

[pimpdave]

Oh good since Jesus is coming back, f*ck my job, it's time to join your cult and give you all my money, right universalchiro?

[crispybits]

And those UC bashers, you like to preach tolerance, say you are against bigotry and such. UC is merely doing what his faith dictates he is supposed to do. He is not harming anyone at all, but considering some of the reactions from you people you'd think UC must have sneaked into your house and murdered your families and raped the family pet.

I don't hate him. In fact, he provides much amusement. I just think he's super silly. He shouldn't get upset when I mock his inane beliefs just like I don't get upset when he says I'll burn in hell. In addition, in the same way that a rational person doesn't engage with a flat-earther, I think his anti-evolutionary assertions are likewise stupid, and honestly they are deserving of mockery when and if he wishes to advocate creationism. The same goes for his prophecies. It's kinda the whole "if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen" thing.

Religions are used to target marks. Either UC is a pro-troll or a grade-A mark.

-TG

+1 to TG

Also, in the marketplace of ideas the bad ones are always challenged, and for the good of society always need to be challenged (sometimes using ridicule). If an idea that is inconsistent internally and which is inconsistent with the evidence we have is not challenged and is left to be, then there will be people that end up thinking "hey, this idea hasnt been debunked, maybe there's something in it."

To take an extreme example, lets imagine someone says "ghosts are real and should have citizenship". That is a very easy to challenge idea, and has been debunked time and time again (yet some people still believe in ghosts). Imagine it had not been debunked, that nobody had challenged it and tested it against the evidence we have of the world and declared it ridiculous. We would move forwards as a society at the very least wasting time and money trying to work out how to give ghosts citizen's rights, and more than that it opens up our society to a whole bunch of really bad ideas based on that initial unchallenged idea.

It's how science and human society works. Someone proposes an idea, and others come along and critique that idea. The ideas that stand up to that critique get adopted and society moves forwards with the ideas that can withstand that criticism. If you fence off certain ideas as being above criticism then you do damage to everyone by changing society into a gullible one.

[notyou2]

And those UC bashers, you like to preach tolerance, say you are against bigotry and such. UC is merely doing what his faith dictates he is supposed to do. He is not harming anyone at all, but considering some of the reactions from you people you'd think UC must have sneaked into your house and murdered your families and raped the family pet.

Christians LOVE persecution. It's their raison d-etre.

[Symmetry]

@Symmetry: best prophecies? They're all the same. Most accurate: IMO NASV is the closest to original manuscript copies.

They're all equally close to the manuscripts? That seems unlikely.

[macbone]

Man, I really want to do a read-through of something like Chesterton's Orthodoxy. It'll probably be trolled all to hell, though, either that or just me posting nonsense over and over again.

In fairness, such a read-through should be accompanied by something like Dawkins' The God Delusion. Or maybe Ludwig Feuerbach's The Essence of Christianity? Or Thus Spoke Zarathustra?

[Symmetry]

Man, I really want to do a read-through of something like Chesterton's Orthodoxy. It'll probably be trolled all to hell, though, either that or just me posting nonsense over and over again.

In fairness, such a read-through should be accompanied by something like Dawkins' The God Delusion. Or maybe Ludwig Feuerbach's The Essence of Christianity? Or Thus Spoke Zarathustra?

I'm not sure that the vast majority of humanity who disagree with your religious tenets are "trolls", dude.

[universalchiro]

Preparing the way for the Messiah will be two witnesses. Keep a look out for these two witnesses that will appear after the 7 year tribulation begins with a peace treaty.