Bundy Ranch, Nevada

[kuthoer]

How ridiculous Phatts. Greece can't print their own money and has to somewhat abide by the laws of the European Union rules and regulation.

Too bad Americans like you constantly put America down cause we have a Democratic Black President. Your partisanship is bleeding through these threads.

You missed the point. But in the process you revealed a few things about yourself.




viewtopic.php?f=8&t=94454&hilit=poll+racism

Yea Phatts! Bundy denies he's a racists too.

[notyou2]

There is something I don't understand about the US. I believe the US is a republic now composed of 50 independent states. During the US civil war, some states wanted to secede from that union. Why did the federal government not simply let them go? If they wanted to leave the union, they should have been allowed to provided a democratic vote of the people was held and secession was passed by a majority of eligible voters within those states. Yet the opposite happened.

What the other people said, and I'd add 2 other reasons.

1.) The whole continent was not settled yet. Large part of the West remained incorporated to either the Union or Confederacy. The civil war started in Kansas when both sides fought over whether it would become a slave state or a free state. This kind of territorial dispute would of played itself out across the rest of the west rendering war virtually inevitable.

2.) The same reason I imagine Quebec hasn't been granted independence. It just creates too many complications. If a strong central government has the power to keep an area within it's control, it just will.

Or I can give the snarky response:

I have No idea! Hindsight is 20/20

FYI, Quebec voted not to separate. Twice.

[chang50]

the Nevada Cattlemen’s Association told ABC News, “This has gotten way out of hand,” while refusing to become involved.

Well thanks for the support. This could happen to anyone of them next.

What,pay their dues,heaven forbid?

[chang50]

Republicans supporters of Bundy are now running for the doors.

Maybe Bundy will now discuss his views on Jews now.

It's turning into a Conservative nightmare,the old fool is giving interviews all over the place and digging a bigger hole each time.Pure comedy gold..

[xtratabasco]

Republicans supporters of Bundy are now running for the doors.

Maybe Bundy will now discuss his views on Jews now.

or I can

[Phatscotty]

This guys a hero indeed. You sure can pickem phatty.

haHAhaHAA! nice try though. I didn't pick anything. This Bundy guy is a clueless old fart, but that doesn't excuse setting up a zone that bans the first amendment. Try to stay focused

[warmonger1981]

What laws say that Constitution Free Speech Zones are legal or are real? I thought free speech was everywhere.

[saxitoxin]

IIRC access for purposes of protest or demonstration can be regulated in areas not customarily open to the public. The government can't regulate you having a protest on a sidewalk or park, but can prohibit or limit to certain areas protests you want to have in the middle of the street, or the lobby of the local social security office, or in the penguin cage at the National Zoo, as long as the regulations are content neutral (i.e. if they let gun control advocates protest in the penguin cage they have to also allow gun rights advocates protest in the penguin cage).

[Dukasaur]

IIRC access for purposes of protest or demonstration can be regulated in areas not customarily open to the public. The government can't regulate you having a protest on a sidewalk or park, but can prohibit or limit to certain areas protests you want to have in the middle of the street, or the lobby of the local social security office, or in the penguin cage at the National Zoo.

I have much better things to do in the penguin cage, anyway.

[kuthoer]

It's becoming more and more clear to Americans who the nutjobs are.

C'mon Phatts, you supported these nut jobs with strong racial views. Anyone who's against the present Federal Government is a true patriot.

[kuthoer]

This guys a hero indeed. You sure can pickem phatty.

haHAhaHAA! nice try though. I didn't pick anything. This Bundy guy is a clueless old fart, but that doesn't excuse setting up a zone that bans the first amendment. Try to stay focused

Look at above post.

[xtratabasco]

c i told u sew

[Phatscotty]

It's becoming more and more clear to Americans who the nutjobs are.

C'mon Phatts, you supported these nut jobs with strong racial views. Anyone who's against the present Federal Government is a true patriot.

Show me where... Since you can't, because there is no support from me, it reveals you continue to make things up to justify your support of the fantasy you try to pass off as reality.

You refer to this as simply a matter of being against the Federal government/being an anarchist?? You think that's what anyone believes this is about? Do you believe that it's at all possible this could be about the federal government abusing their power/threatening force on humans to...

SAVE THE TORTOISES!

Do you think it's at all possible it could be about setting up zones that restrict the 1st amendment? HINT: read the OP

[Phatscotty]

This guys a hero indeed. You sure can pickem phatty.

haHAhaHAA! nice try though. I didn't pick anything. This Bundy guy is a clueless old fart, but that doesn't excuse setting up a zone that bans the first amendment. Try to stay focused

Look at above post.

What about it? That only makes sense if you think the Constitution and Bill of Rights doesn't apply to ALL Americans equally. Oh, you are a socialist...makes sense. So just come out and admit it then, you don't think rights apply to all people equally, especially if you don't like them or they disagree with you. You think then it's perfectly okay to set up a zone that bans the 1st amendment.

ROCK ON!

[saxitoxin]

Scott, a question ...

Do you believe the land was (a) publicly-owned land that was always closed to the public* and the government temporarily opened up certain sections to allow the pro-Bundy protesters, or, (b) publicly-owned land that was always open to the public and the government temporarily closed it except certain sections to allow the pro-Bundy protesters? (My understanding is "A" is the correct version but a few radio hosts have been describing events in reverse, as "B.")

* e.g.: Checkerboard Rock in Rocky Mountain National Park during raptor mating season, nuclear missile test pads at Vandenberg Air Force Base, Michelle Obama's bathroom while she's showering, Ms. McDonald's kindergarten room at Plainview Elementary School while class is in session, etc.

[kuthoer]

It's becoming more and more clear to Americans who the nutjobs are.

C'mon Phatts, you supported these nut jobs with strong racial views. Anyone who's against the present Federal Government is a true patriot.

Show me where... Since you can't, because there is no support from me, it reveals you continue to make things up to justify your support of the fantasy you try to pass off as reality.

You refer to this as simply a matter of being against the Federal government/being an anarchist?? You think that's what anyone believes this is about? Do you believe that it's at all possible this could be about the federal government abusing their power/threatening force on humans to...

SAVE THE TORTOISES!

Do you think it's at all possible it could be about setting up zones that restrict the 1st amendment? HINT: read the OP

Bundy and his right wing militia friends want to turn the clock back by force if the need arises. These Aryan Brotherhood types wants to get rid of that Negro guy in the White House and restore White Power in America, as they think White Americans are being oppressed.

The Republicans and Fox News came out strong for Bundy, but now they're cowering from this mess. Stupid Bundy and his Anarchists buddies are racists, but should keep their traps shut, sort of like the Republican Party (deny, deny and deny that you're a racists) but never admit you want the Negro back on the Plantation and Mexicans deported.

Yes Phatts, let's free the oppressed Whites in America! Let's restore America to it's former greatness when Whites ruled America and everyone else knew their place! Ooooops, forgot about those damned broads, yea let's put those women back in kitchen, pregnant and barefoot.

God bless you Phatts. Now go team up with Jesus and make America great!

[Phatscotty]

okay Kuth, that has nothing to do with the topic, nor did you back up your statement. It's okay, I knew you couldn't.

For you punishment, I sentence you to view a video of a speech made by one of our most important founders, which emphasizes the principles upon which this nation was born. Pay special attention to how we argued that rights are not solely for princes and kings and wealthy people and the politically correct, but how even the poorest and sickest and uneducated and lowest among us, even people who you don't like something they said, has the same basic human rights than any king or prince or rich person or politically correct elitist has.



It seems like race is all you can think about, all you can talk about, all you consider; so you are a textbook racist. I don't have any videos for that.

[Phatscotty]

Scott, a question ...

Do you believe the land was (a) publicly-owned land that was always closed to the public* and the government temporarily opened up certain sections to allow the pro-Bundy protesters, or, (b) publicly-owned land that was always open to the public and the government temporarily closed it except certain sections to allow the pro-Bundy protesters? (My understanding is "A" is the correct version but a few radio hosts have been describing events in reverse, as "B.")

* e.g.: Checkerboard Rock in Rocky Mountain National Park during raptor mating season, nuclear missile test pads at Vandenberg Air Force Base, Michelle Obama's bathroom while she's showering, Ms. McDonald's kindergarten room at Plainview Elementary School while class is in session, etc.

I do not know which is correct, and I'm not sure anybody truly knows all the facts of this case, not even Bundy. For one, how do we know Bundy was truly billed 1 million dollars? Is the bill really only $200,000? How do we know what Harry Reid has in mind playing with the boundaries of what is public land closed to the public or not and what the agenda really is? Do we know for sure if this land was grandfathered in for the Bundy family or not? I've heard a lot of different things. And if the gov't set up a special area for protest, that means they also set up everywhere else as a ban on protesting.

To keep it short and sweet, regardless of what the situation with the land is, there is a way the government should go about dealing with the Bundys, and a way they shouldn't go about it. I opine the government should have taken the route that it is currently taking, which is through the courts. They should not have shown up with armored vehicles and snipers with evolving stories about how this was about the tortoises (which some people actually bought) and then it was about an unpaid bill. So we know the gov't is full of it, and the Bundy's may be full of it too.

This is about abuse of power and bullying. If they are going to arrest Bundy or confiscate that land or the cattle, then they need to get a warrant and do things the proper way so that citizens have the opportunity to have their say and defend themselves and have their day in court. I would hope all Americans could still agree on this, short of Kuth, who wants to lynch the guy because he said something he didn't like.

[saxitoxin]

They should not have shown up with armored vehicles and snipers

Bundy is a follower of William Luther Pierce - who Tim McVeigh declared was his inspiration - whose blueprint for the overthrow of the U.S. government was so detailed he had to present it in novel form for legal reasons. Here's a relatively tame passage:

Our broadcasts have helped this process along greatly. We have exaggerated our own strength, of course, and have told White
servicemen who want to join our units where to go. And to help convince them-as well as to keep the niggers spooked and doing their
thing-we have turned one of our transmitters into a phony "soul" station and been broadcasting a call for a Black revolution, telling the
Blacks to shoot their White officers and non-coms before the Whites can disarm them.

The cops' communications and power were knocked out, and their building was set afire in a dozen places. They had to evacuate the
building, and we rained 81-mm mortar fire down on the surrounding parking lots and streets until the area became untenable for
them.

I nearly got into a shooting fight with a company commander near City Hall this morning about nine o'clock. That's where we were
taking all the big shots to be hanged: a number of prominent Hollywood actors and actresses, and several TV personalities. If we had strung them up in front of their homes like everyone else, only a few people would have seen them, and we wanted their example to be instructive to a much wider audience. For the same reason many of the priests on our lists were taken to one of three large churches where we had TV crews set up to broadcast their executions.

The trouble was that many of the big shots were arriving at City Hall already more dead than alive. The troops on the transport trucks
were really giving them a working over. One famous actress, a notorious race-mixer who had starred in several large-budget, interracial "love" epics, had lost most of her hair, an eye, and several teeth-not to mention all her clothes-before the rope was put around her neck. She was a bruised and bloody mess. I wouldn't have known who she was if I hadn't asked.

Now that most of the organized resistance against us here has been neutralized, everything hinges on whether we can get this area
effectively under our control before military units from other parts of the country are sent in.

It just seems like good planning to prepare for the worst that could happen in any life situation. The worst that could happen with striking 2nd grade teachers probably doesn't require much more than security guards with pepper spray and rape whistles. The worst that could happen with striking National Alliance and Posse Commitatus cells probably requires tanks and snipers on standby, just in case.

If they are going to arrest Bundy or confiscate that land or the cattle, then they need to get a warrant and do things the proper way so that citizens have the opportunity to have their say and defend themselves and have their day in court.

Like in Case No. 2:12-cv-0804-LDG-GWF United States vs. Bundy?

And if the gov't set up a special area for protest, that means they also set up everywhere else as a ban on protesting.

I think the U.S. constitution set that up. The Public Forum doctrine allows the government to restrict access by pedestrians or the general public in areas that are not normally used by pedestrians or the general public. That's why 700 OWS protesters were arrested in 2012 for protesting in the middle of a street cars were trying to drive down, or 37 people were arrested this year for climbing over the fence of a nuclear weapons base to protest. Do you think the first amendment protects people going inside nuclear launch control rooms as long as they're there to protest something?

[Phatscotty]

So what do you think the Feds should do? Why not put a lien on his house and his property, or get a warrant for his arrest? What's your opinion on why they originally said it was about the desert tortoise? What's the deal with the million dollar unpaid bill?

And what's up with this?


Just asking your opinion cuz you have an interesting angle on the whole story and it's entertaining.

[saxitoxin]

So what do you think the Feds should do?

The feds should do what a court authorizes them to do. The U.S. District Court for Southern Nevada authorized them to seize any of Bundy's cattle that were grazing on the BLM land after giving a minimum of 45 days final warning.

Why not put a lien on his house and his property, or get a warrant for his arrest?

Because the court didn't authorize them to do that?

[Phatscotty]

So what do you think the Feds should do?

The feds should do what a court authorizes them to do. The U.S. District Court for Southern Nevada authorized them to seize any of Bundy's cattle that were grazing on the BLM land after giving a minimum of 45 days final warning.

Why not put a lien on his house and his property, or get a warrant for his arrest?

Because the court didn't authorize them to do that?

I suspect that's what they are doing now. And at that time, given the circumstances, might wanna bring some guns and that tough ass old Western Sheriff n his posse. Maybe then it will be the next Ruby Ridge, and we'll see what the drones can do.

[kuthoer]

So what do you think the Feds should do?

The feds should do what a court authorizes them to do. The U.S. District Court for Southern Nevada authorized them to seize any of Bundy's cattle that were grazing on the BLM land after giving a minimum of 45 days final warning.

Why not put a lien on his house and his property, or get a warrant for his arrest?

Because the court didn't authorize them to do that?

I suspect that's what they are doing now. And at that time, given the circumstances, might wanna bring some guns and that tough ass old Western Sheriff n his posse. Maybe then it will be the next Ruby Ridge, and we'll see what the drones can do.

The only support that Bundy has now is the Aryan Brotherhood. The next time The Federal Agents will grab that deadbeat Bundy without incidence and confiscate all his assets.

He's enjoyed his 15 minutes of fame.