Medal Stripping

[Great-Ollie]

Also according to the rules, we should get some form of explanation why tec805, grifftron, John Deere, and myself got medals stripped. We did nothing offensive. Still waiting on a reason mods. Please post here what we did in the thread that was offensive enough for this ruling. It is not written in the RULES that leaders will be held accountable, so wth?

players will be denied medals if their behaviour is deemed to be disruptive or inappropriate, even if it does not meet the site wide policy for a forum infraction.

This is how it is written, period.

Interesting that all of a sudden Masli has me foed as well. I guess there may be a secret agenda here that runs deeper then i realize. Both clan moderators are flexing their muscle with no one to police them? hmmmmmmmm, be very scared people.

[codeblue1018]

Pack hating? No, not so much pal; don't flatter yourself. Your clan made complete and utter fools of yourselves-no one will disagree with that. As a result, rules, CC rules were violated and therefore consequences followed. As leader of your Clan Ollie, you allowed your members to run amuck in forum and only "stopped" it once mods became involved. Move on mate, rebuild The Packs reputation and maybe one day you can resurrect yourselves.
Perhaps the mods could have handled this better; I won't disagree with that, however action should have been taken. Ollie you resorted to flaming me as did JD once I made my first post in here. I made no negative reference to you; I merely said sound decision. Think before you type mate; this is what got you into this mess to begin with.
JD really? Should I be concerned about clan medals? Lol. Nice comeback.

[lynch5762]

Fact based post:

This is not about hating the pack. It's about atrocious behavior.

From the IA war thread - Oct 3rd. - page 21...

I just want to let everyone know that the CDs are watching this thread closely. I also want to remind you all of the following:

Subject: Clan Medals [Revamp 2011]

War Thread Behaviour

In order to curb some poor behaviour in the war threads, players will be denied medals if their behaviour is deemed to be disruptive or inappropriate, even if it does not meet the site wide policy for a forum infraction. In the past, we’ve locked war threads due to the behaviour of a single individual, thus inherently punishing both clans. In order to be consistent, this will only be applied by the Clan Dept Head (most often these issues are raised by the CD team).

In other words, let's keep this civil. Thanks.

Yes you were warned. Publicly and also by private message according to one of your posts around page 36.

I believe you did not finish reading this quote from chemefreak jefjef???

"To the Peanut Gallery:

Both clan leaders know we CDs, myself included, have nothing against either clan. If fact, both clan leaders have pm'd me expressing their approval of this reminder. The reminder was directed at everyone, including players not in this war. Thus far the thread is highly amusing and right on the edge (give or take a word or two) of what a WAR thread probably should look like. If anyone has any further issues please feel free to message any of the CDs for further discussions.

This one is going to be close. I personally blew my prediction on this one. For that, I anticipate plenty of (deserved) crap from The Pack Let's keep in clean and keep it fun.

Cheers."

I repeat a portion that you left out.... "thus far this thread is highly amusing and right on the edge (give or take a word or two) of what a WAR thread probably should look like....."

So I am confused............. is this a warning or in fact a conformation that this is what a WAR thread should look like????? (I do believe though, as Great-Ollie has stated several times, that we did receive our official warning on page 36

Now let's talk about your quote.... "The problem was you weren't and had an established history of violating CC's rules. (Yes - CC's rules - They are not chemefreaks rules)."

If you are going to make a statement like this please do the following:

#1: PLEASE BACK IT UP......... CAN YOU SHOW ME SPECIFICS OF OUR ESTABLISHED HISTORY OF VIOLATING CC'S RULE'S???? (I await your response)
#2: FURTHERMORE........ DO YOU REALIZE THAT YOUR POST IS IN VIOLATION OF THE "FORUM GUIDELINES" RULE CONCERNING "TROLLING"??? ..... I suggest you actually read the guidelines because you are in fact in violation by making the statement that you did

Trust me when I say this folks.... I have much more to say on this issue but I decided to get my feet wet by addressing this severely UNEDUCATED post....

[malevolous]

Maybe I'm just excessively innocent here, but I really doubt there is a conspiracy/secret agenda. No one gains anything by making CC less fun. I followed the thread in question for a while, but stopped at some point in early October due to what was being said. I have a lot of respect for many members of the Pack as players, but I'm inclined to believe the thread warranted some discipline. On that note, maybe Cheme has beef and the punishment was excessive, but I trust the CDs to be moderate as, again, I believe they only have the best interests of the site in mind. I just really doubt all the CDs are out to get someone, and think that, for what I saw on the forum, intervention was necessary. They made a decision based on the rules as they stood at the start of the war, and I don't think this thread will do anything positive. Just my $.02

[grifftron]

Where is my medal? Medals are all I care about in life ANd now my medal flow is being messed with! At least Pm me and tell me what I did wrong please... I know it's against cc rule to post anything bad no no about cc mod so me wont, medal Plz ?

[lynch5762]

Pack hating? No, not so much pal; don't flatter yourself. Your clan made complete and utter fools of yourselves-no one will disagree with that. As a result, rules, CC rules were violated and therefore consequences followed. As leader of your Clan Ollie, you allowed your members to run amuck in forum and only "stopped" it once mods became involved. Move on mate, rebuild The Packs reputation and maybe one day you can resurrect yourselves.
Perhaps the mods could have handled this better; I won't disagree with that, however action should have been taken. Ollie you resorted to flaming me as did JD once I made my first post in here. I made no negative reference to you; I merely said sound decision. Think before you type mate; this is what got you into this mess to begin with.
JD really? Should I be concerned about clan medals? Lol. Nice comeback.

I AM SORRY PAL,

BUT AS WE MENTIONED IN THE OPENING LINE OF THIS THREAD.... WE ARE LOOKING FOR "FACT BASED" OPINIONS HERE NOT.... "Your clan made complete and utter fools of yourselves-no one will disagree with that.".... AND WE ARE NOT INTERESTED IN YOUR ADVICE AS TO HOW WE SHOULD WORK ON OUR "SO-CALLED" RESURRECTION...

SO NOW YOU.... ARE ALSO GUILTY OF THE "FORUM GUIDELINES" RULES CONCERNING TROLLING.....

[John Deere]

Pack hating? No, not so much pal; don't flatter yourself. Your clan made complete and utter fools of yourselves-no one will disagree with that. As a result, rules, CC rules were violated and therefore consequences followed. As leader of your Clan Ollie, you allowed your members to run amuck in forum and only "stopped" it once mods became involved. Move on mate, rebuild The Packs reputation and maybe one day you can resurrect yourselves.
Perhaps the mods could have handled this better; I won't disagree with that, however action should have been taken. Ollie you resorted to flaming me as did JD once I made my first post in here. I made no negative reference to you; I merely said sound decision. Think before you type mate; this is what got you into this mess to begin with.
JD really? Should I be concerned about clan medals? Lol. Nice comeback.

Once again we get nothing but crap from people that are known to not like us, who would have thought. Also we dont need to "resurrect" ourselfs, our record speaks for itself, we cant help help it that people get there feelers hurt so damn easy. Hell just think if our thread would have been half as bad as most BPB threads. We would all be banned Ignorance is bliss. Keep it up guys!

[Great-Ollie]

Maybe I'm just excessively innocent here, but I really doubt there is a conspiracy/secret agenda. No one gains anything by making CC less fun. I followed the thread in question for a while, but stopped at some point in early October due to what was being said. I have a lot of respect for many members of the Pack as players, but I'm inclined to believe the thread warranted some discipline. On that note, maybe Cheme has beef and the punishment was excessive, but I trust the CDs to be moderate as, again, I believe they only have the best interests of the site in mind. I just really doubt all the CDs are out to get someone, and think that, for what I saw on the forum, intervention was necessary. They made a decision based on the rules as they stood at the start of the war, and I don't think this thread will do anything positive. Just my $.02

Normally totally agree with you bud, but chemefreak has stated in private pm that he is going to make example out of our clan. Secondly publically stated he hated our clan, and thirdly will not provide any explanations why certain members were stripped of their medals. Everything was great, we won the war, we behaved ourselves, everything was looking good. Then chemefreak did this. We obeyed all rules after our warning and this is what we got. We were already to move on and obey forum guidelines from our last warning, yet chemefreak knew he could get us going. Why respect them when they show us no respect? We kept our end of the bargain, then they totally screwed us, hence why anyone who is an outsider does not get that chemefreak is out to destroy us and is doing a great job.

[John Deere]

Thus far the thread is highly amusing and right on the edge (give or take a word or two) of what a WAR thread probably should look like. If anyone has any further issues please feel free to message any of the CDs for further discussions.

Can any of the mods please reply to this brought up by Lynch? How is this a warning?

[malevolous]

Maybe I'm just excessively innocent here, but I really doubt there is a conspiracy/secret agenda. No one gains anything by making CC less fun. I followed the thread in question for a while, but stopped at some point in early October due to what was being said. I have a lot of respect for many members of the Pack as players, but I'm inclined to believe the thread warranted some discipline. On that note, maybe Cheme has beef and the punishment was excessive, but I trust the CDs to be moderate as, again, I believe they only have the best interests of the site in mind. I just really doubt all the CDs are out to get someone, and think that, for what I saw on the forum, intervention was necessary. They made a decision based on the rules as they stood at the start of the war, and I don't think this thread will do anything positive. Just my $.02

Normally totally agree with you bud, but chemefreak has stated in private pm that he is going to make example out of our clan. Secondly publically stated he hated our clan, and thirdly will not provide any explanations why certain members were stripped of their medals. Everything was great, we won the war, we behaved ourselves, everything was looking good. Then chemefreak did this. We obeyed all rules after our warning and this is what we got. We were already to move on and obey forum guidelines from our last warning, yet chemefreak knew he could get us going. Why respect them when they show us no respect? We kept our end of the bargain, then they totally screwed us, hence why anyone who is an outsider does not get that chemefreak is out to destroy us and is doing a great job.

I know it sucks, and maybe he is. I don't know, but generally taking personal feuds and making them public only antagonizes people. If its figured out in private #1 no one will get publicly humiliated in public, making compromise easier to reach and #2 will avoid splitting the rest of the site over an issue that is really only between .1%(assuming roughly 20 people are involved) of the population. Again, just my opinion, but I don't think this thread will do anything positive.

[Great-Ollie]

We tried to do it privately and received nothing back. Read chemefreaks wall, i pleaded with him all day, and nothing. We pmed multiple mods and have got nothing back. Have i ever started a thread for this reason my entire CC life? No. Normally i let everything slide and laugh about it later, but this is so obvious when you are sitting in our shoes. NO explanations, no warnings, no communication, nothing. Mod abuse.

[Great-Ollie]

Hey fellow CC'ers. I have an issue and i would like you opinions on it please. Check out this thread. viewtopic.php?f=438&t=157612

[betiko]

Maybe I'm just excessively innocent here, but I really doubt there is a conspiracy/secret agenda. No one gains anything by making CC less fun. I followed the thread in question for a while, but stopped at some point in early October due to what was being said. I have a lot of respect for many members of the Pack as players, but I'm inclined to believe the thread warranted some discipline. On that note, maybe Cheme has beef and the punishment was excessive, but I trust the CDs to be moderate as, again, I believe they only have the best interests of the site in mind. I just really doubt all the CDs are out to get someone, and think that, for what I saw on the forum, intervention was necessary. They made a decision based on the rules as they stood at the start of the war, and I don't think this thread will do anything positive. Just my $.02

Normally totally agree with you bud, but chemefreak has stated in private pm that he is going to make example out of our clan. Secondly publically stated he hated our clan, and thirdly will not provide any explanations why certain members were stripped of their medals. Everything was great, we won the war, we behaved ourselves, everything was looking good. Then chemefreak did this. We obeyed all rules after our warning and this is what we got. We were already to move on and obey forum guidelines from our last warning, yet chemefreak knew he could get us going. Why respect them when they show us no respect? We kept our end of the bargain, then they totally screwed us, hence why anyone who is an outsider does not get that chemefreak is out to destroy us and is doing a great job.

I know it sucks, and maybe he is. I don't know, but generally taking personal feuds and making them public only antagonizes people. If its figured out in private #1 no one will get publicly humiliated in public, making compromise easier to reach and #2 will avoid splitting the rest of the site over an issue that is really only between .1%(assuming roughly 20 people are involved) of the population. Again, just my opinion, but I don't think this thread will do anything positive.

so true!
I just think that sometimes when you feel something unfair is done to you you are not the best person to defend yourself, as you are more lead by passion than reason. that's when attorneys come in handy!
I don t think this is about public humiliation though, he made this thread just to gather other people's opionon (preferably people reasonable and with common sense, which seems to be your case). People that might have been reading the thread and can give an opinion about it.
It's not 20 people involved, it's 5. we just want to know why these 5 in particular.

[gradybridges]

So silly not to give them the medal they earned.

There were alot of people talking trash in that thead, many not in THE PACK or IA trying to stir shit up. And then like all heated internet threads it gets stupid and goes on and on. Are people on here really that fragile that the thread hurt their feelings? I don't see the big deal. There were many "guilty" parties and to punish only 1 clan is a bad way to go.

Where there any penalties discussed for the non PACK/IA who were stirring the pot? Can't take away a medal. What about banning them from their next clan war?

If you don't like THE PACK and all their trash talk there is one way to shut them up-beat them in a war. And you don't have to read past the first post in the clan war thread if trash talking from people you will never meet on the opposite side of the world bothers you.

I hope the war with IA isn't an excuse for the top 4 clans not to play THE PACK.

[Army of GOD]

Medals shouldn't be stripped but forum bans should be handed out.

Not really sure why medals matter.

[b00060]

Way to much to read and I know a lot of you but don't follow clan allegiances much so here is my worthless 2 cents. If you do something wrong and you know it is wrong, you should face the consequences. If you get warned for something you did not know you were doing wrong and you continue to do it, you should face the consequences. If you get warned and stop doing what was wrong, then you should not face any consequences, hence the warning. I guess the ? here is did they stop after they were warned. I am not going to try and look at the timelines to hazard a verdict, especially since pms may have been exchanged. If they didn't then lesson learned, but if they did stop after being warned I think the verdict may be harsh.

[Night Strike]

Why don't you let clan issues stay in the clan forums instead of spamming them elsewhere? The only goal here is to get all the people sympathetic to your point to post in outrage rather than to become knowledgeable about the situation.

[Great-Ollie]

Actually i was hoping to get everyone's opinion, so why don't you let me post in general discussion? Do i not have the right to do that now? Why are the mods trying to continue to derail me and my quest for answers. Spamming? Really, can i not value opinions outside the clan world when it comes to mod abuse and rules pertaining to this website? Please only constructive opinions here. Thanks

[Stephan Wayne]

Why don't you let clan issues stay in the clan forums instead of spamming them elsewhere? The only goal here is to get all the people sympathetic to your point to post in outrage rather than to become knowledgeable about the situation.

There is the possibility this is to gain support for a change in rules.

[Night Strike]

Why don't you let clan issues stay in the clan forums instead of spamming them elsewhere? The only goal here is to get all the people sympathetic to your point to post in outrage rather than to become knowledgeable about the situation.

There is the possibility this is to gain support for a change in rules.

If you don't participate in clans and/or have no plans to, the rules that affect clans do not affect you.


("You" is a general term, not specifically referring to Stephen Wayne)

[Great-Ollie]

But mod abuse does. Please let people decide for themselves rather then jump all over my post for no reason, thanks.

[lord voldemort]

Actually i was hoping to get everyone's opinion, so why don't you let me post in general discussion? Do i not have the right to do that now? Why are the mods trying to continue to derail me and my quest for answers. Spamming? Really, can i not value opinions outside the clan world when it comes to mod abuse and rules pertaining to this website? Please only constructive opinions here. Thanks

The majority of people from the outside wont be constructive though. That is NS point

[jghost7]

So silly not to give them the medal they earned.

There were alot of people talking trash in that thead, many not in THE PACK or IA trying to stir shit up. And then like all heated internet threads it gets stupid and goes on and on. Are people on here really that fragile that the thread hurt their feelings? I don't see the big deal. There were many "guilty" parties and to punish only 1 clan is a bad way to go.

Where there any penalties discussed for the non PACK/IA who were stirring the pot? Can't take away a medal. What about banning them from their next clan war?

If you don't like THE PACK and all their trash talk there is one way to shut them up-beat them in a war. And you don't have to read past the first post in the clan war thread if trash talking from people you will never meet on the opposite side of the world bothers you.

I hope the war with IA isn't an excuse for the top 4 clans not to play THE PACK.

I agree.

Simply put, there are no official descriptions of what gets disciplined in a war thread.

War Thread Behaviour

In order to curb some poor behaviour in the war threads, players will be denied medals if their behaviour is deemed to be disruptive or inappropriate, even if it does not meet the site wide policy for a forum infraction. In the past, we’ve locked war threads due to the behaviour of a single individual, thus inherently punishing both clans. In order to be consistent, this will only be applied by the Clan Dept Head (most often these issues are raised by the CD team).

This statement is vague and does nothing to clarify what will be punished. It is just a blanket statement saying that you can be punished for anything you say at their discretion. I think it is a poor way to try to '...curb some poor behaviour...' in the war threads. There is no way to know if your post will violate the rule since there is no definition and is only based off an opinion. So it would be easy to assume a bias could be involved whether or not it was.

I believe if you were to insist on this method you would need to publicly warn the individual and then move to penalties afterwords if there are further infractions. That being said, it seriously impinges on the whole point of the war thread. You may as well just allow the first post and updates to it. That would accomplish the task. Nobody would post but the OP. I naively thought that war threads were for a bit of fun and trash talking. I have heard of legendary war threads and how they were sometimes more interesting than the wars themselves. That will never happen again with this in effect.

Also some important questions, how do you punish similarly guilty parties on the losing side? or 3rd parties in the war thread? I just don't think that this was well thought out. From what I can tell, you only proposed to punish the winning clan? So, if you have lost the challenge you can say what you like?

As it stands right now, any post could potentially be considered a violation and be punished with no explanation or warning. You may as well not post just to be safe, and that is a pitiful state of being.

I personally don't think it is fair to have a judgement based on an opinion to have an enforceable punishment, especially with no definition of the infraction available. Also, it is unbalanced as there is currently no apparent repercussions for any non-winning party similarly involved in the clan war thread.

I say this from a neutral position and would like this to be further evaluated and clarified so that everyone will know what to expect in the future.

Thanks,

J

[danryan]

I can haz striped medal? Plz?

[grifftron]

Once again I just want to know why I wasn't given my medal, quote me for whatever I said, if its PG rated.. OK take my medal away, but anyone who knows me knows I am obsessed with medals, i would do anything to get a medal... have no clue why I didn't receive this one.