Some Days Left to BREXIT

saxitoxin · Post by **saxitoxin** » Wed Sep 04, 2019 1:31 pm

LOL ... the House of Lords has proposed more than 100 amendments to the No Deal Brexit bill to sandbag it from passing before parliament is suspended.

https://www.theguardian.com%2Fpolitics% ... 8142582617

The master becomes the disciple. Politics American style!

GoranZ · Post by **GoranZ** » Wed Sep 04, 2019 5:04 pm

UK Lawmakers Reject Prime Minister Johnson's Request to Hold an Early Election

Yesterday he suffered a punch from the left, today from the right. BREXIT ain't gonna happen any time soon.

saxitoxin · Post by **saxitoxin** » Wed Sep 04, 2019 5:08 pm

GoranZ wrote:UK Lawmakers Reject Prime Minister Johnson's Request to Hold an Early Election

Yesterday he suffered a punch from the left, today from the right. BREXIT ain't gonna happen any time soon.

BJ should call for a vote of No Confidence in himself. That only needs a majority to pass and would force an election. I think?

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Wed Sep 04, 2019 6:47 pm

It would eventually, although I think there's a delay to give him time to try and build confidence before a second vote. So Parliament would end up getting prorogued first anyway.

You are right though, the Lords will do their best to see us through this mess. Apparently they have set up a rota to ensure that there will be peers present around the clock who are willing to debate each and every amendment at great length.

jonesthecurl · Post by **jonesthecurl** » Wed Sep 04, 2019 7:22 pm

just saw a wonderful comment:

Boris would be out of his depth standing on a damp cloth

GoranZ · Post by **GoranZ** » Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:23 pm

jonesthecurl wrote:just saw a wonderful comment:

Boris would be out of his depth standing on a damp cloth

This one is much better

"You should be in Brussels negotiating!"

jonesthecurl · Post by **jonesthecurl** » Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:56 pm

I liked that one too.

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Fri Sep 06, 2019 5:54 pm

I see the Twitter poster cut out the clips of all the people in the crowd cheering Brexit, or even the very same guy Boris is talking to there saying that he wants the UK out of the EU.

Post by **Dukasaur** » Fri Sep 06, 2019 5:58 pm

What happened to the filibuster in the House of Lords?

I haven't heard any mention of it. Everyone is talking about the delay deal getting Royal Assent on Monday.

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:02 am

They decided not to in the end and everyone went home at 01:30am. I haven't been able to find anything that says why. I think the Conservative lords just decided it wasn't a good idea after all and gave up.

Post by **Dukasaur** » Sat Sep 07, 2019 9:03 am

mrswdk wrote:They decided not to in the end and everyone went home at 01:30am. I haven't been able to find anything that says why. I think the Conservative lords just decided it wasn't a good idea after all and gave up.

That sucks. I was looking forward to it.

Post by **Dukasaur** » Sat Sep 07, 2019 9:49 am

It's funny. I believe, as I always have, that Brexit is a stupid idea. And yet, I cannot help but be drawn to Johnson's side.

The logic is unassailable. "This is what we agreed to do. Let's do it finally and move on."

It's not about what would have been /should have been. It's about accepting that the referendum is over, we lost, shake the hand of the opposite team and walk off the field with something resembling dignity. 200 years from now the history books are not going to note whether British beef was sold duty-free in Milan. They will note that this is the year that Parliament did back-flips and somersaults to renege on its promise to honour the results of the referendum. Will they also note that this was the beginning of the end of Britain's respect for democracy?

waauw · Post by **waauw** » Sat Sep 07, 2019 10:13 am

Interestingly people seem to just assume the EU will accept another extension. France however has already mentioned it might refuse. Macron and the liberal fraction in the EU want to implement progressive reforms and thus see Brexit as an opportunity of ditching a load eurosceptics out of parliament. It's ironic how in this situation the eurofederalists and Brexiters might actually align.

saxitoxin · Post by **saxitoxin** » Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:36 pm

waauw wrote:Interestingly people seem to just assume the EU will accept another extension. France however has already mentioned it might refuse. Macron and the liberal fraction in the EU want to implement progressive reforms and thus see Brexit as an opportunity of ditching a load eurosceptics out of parliament. It's ironic how in this situation the eurofederalists and Brexiters might actually align.

I think this is the reason the Lords decided not to filibuster. The EU needs unanimity to offer an extension. So ...

(A) BoJo could request an extension for the UK and then vote down giving the UK an extension since the UK will still be a voting member of the EU when it comes time to vote on said extension

(B) If A is precluded by the language of the new No No Deal bill he can just ask Viktor Orban to vote no and, unrelated, Britain will happen to send $100mm of foreign aid to Hungarian dirt farms in 2021

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Sat Sep 07, 2019 6:46 pm

I agree with Duk. Whatever someone’s view on the referendum, it would be far better to just rip the plaster off now than spend the next 5 years continuing to flail around in circles because some MPs still refuse to accept what is happening. Nowadays government energy is so constantly focused on Brexit that policy-making in other areas (health, education etc) is grinding to a halt. Not to mention the damage to business that the constant uncertainty is having. All the fighting the inevitable is a waste of time and energy.

I hope someone on the EU side vetoes the extension but I’m not hoping too hard. For all Macron’s tough talk, if everyone else rounds on him about the damage of a no deal, peace in Ireland etc he’s probably going to give in and support an extension just to avoid being seen as the prick.

At this rate the time wasters will get their way, then there will be an election, then the Tories will decimate Labour and force a Brexit at the end of this next delay.

jonesthecurl · Post by **jonesthecurl** » Sat Sep 07, 2019 8:39 pm

Unfortunately, if a no-deal happens, it won't be the end of it - it will leave everything still to be done in terms of future relations with Europe generally.

saxitoxin · Post by **saxitoxin** » Sun Sep 08, 2019 12:32 am

UK to EU - "Kick us out or we'll become the shittiest flatmate in history"

The extraordinary plan would see the UK refuse to appoint a commissioner, putting the EU in breach of its own legal duty for all 28 member states to be represented on its executive branch.

Article 17 of the Treaty on European Union means the EU will “not be legally constituted on 1 November” – the date the new European Commission takes office – without a UK commissioner, it says.

Brussels could try to reduce the number of commissioners from 28, one for each state, but the UK would have a veto which it would use unless the EU bent to its will.

A source said: “We will turn the pressure onto the EU to show how difficult it will be for them if the UK is still hanging around.”

http://www.independent.co.uk%2Fnews%2Fu ... 6812641195

Post by **Dukasaur** » Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:26 am

jonesthecurl wrote:Unfortunately, if a no-deal happens, it won't be the end of it - it will leave everything still to be done in terms of future relations with Europe generally.

Of course it will. But it will be a lot more straightforward working on deals once it is known for sure what the parameters are, instead of people playing with 'hypothetical's and 'maybe's.

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Sun Sep 08, 2019 2:55 pm

And without remain traitors continuing to try and keep the UK in.

Post by **Dukasaur** » Sun Sep 08, 2019 5:19 pm

mrswdk wrote:And without remain traitors continuing to try and keep the UK in.

I very much doubt if they're traitors. I think they're just as patriotic as you; they just have a different idea of what's the best way forward.

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Mon Sep 09, 2019 4:35 pm

I’m not a patriot. Patriotism is for Victorians and Americans.

waauw · Post by **waauw** » Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:26 am

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:14 pm

I vote nothing.

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Mon Sep 16, 2019 10:31 am

mrswdk · Post by **mrswdk** » Mon Sep 16, 2019 10:48 am

Johnson would demolish all opposition in any election if held tomorrow:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ical-chaos

Some Days Left to BREXIT

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