The Tick Mafia - JUSTICE PREVAILS!

[PepeAtila]

TO MOD
In this https://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewt ... 0#p5298581
I did vote DDS ... was not valid ?

[degaston]

Vote Count:

• Razorvich : 3 (*Pixar*, Extreme Ways, Ragian)
  PepeAtila : 1 (DirtyDishSoap)
  DirtyDishSoap : 1 (PepeAtila)
  Loose Canon : 0 ()
  
  No Vote : 13 (Charle, Darin44, DukeHazzard, fusibaseball, General Bax, Loose Canon, Maxleod, Razorvich, SoN!c, strike wolf, swang918, TrafalgarLaw01, traffic133)

18 Alive, 10 votes needed to lynch

/Sorry Pepe, I missed that.

[SoN!c]

Town won't know if scum has daychat or not.

I consider it standard for scum to only be able to chat at night. I've added this to the rules in the OP.

Very good info. This means scum was not able to chat during the day yesterday and they had to guess..right?

It adds fuel on the theory why Pix was balancing the cord so hard. I believe somebody posted "Now I will say Pixar seems to be trying to be scummy enough to try force a visit at night, without saying he wants to be visited like godfather last night, so I will keep that for future reference."

Same theory applies a bit to Loose when he posted the following on Mon Sep 04, 2023 6:27 pm:
"Maybe I'll get a night time reaction." and the Pix / Loose "saving each other" thingie.


About the Raz bw forming:

He posted this on Mon Sep 11:

My appologies for not posting.. I have been bombed at work over this last week and then a cassino run (which I am still recovering)
Will gather my thoughts and post something really really good asap

It's been an entire week by now and i have not seen anything good, or anything at all?. I wanna hear Raz too ASAP but other then that i got nothing on him.

In any case : scum to only be able to chat at night also means scum had a lot of chatter going on during the first night and should have a solid scum team strategy by now. That is what to expect i think. Do we see changes in D1 vs D2 posts.. ? I say yes, especially with Loose. But if that is the case there must be a mastermind giving orders / taking the lead .?

That brings me back to another line somebody posted that i keep remembering "Pixar's reaction is also weird to me. It was already getting a little fishy that there seemed to be a core group of vocal players adamantly against jumping on the free-claim wagon when I don't see a drawback to getting information out in the open."

That core group needs to be followed up.

[Loose Canon]

Does anyone know a way of searching all posts by a given player?
When I type in a players name in the "search this topic" at the top I'm sure it isn't giving me all/most times any of a players posts?

[SoN!c]

Does anyone know a way of searching all posts by a given player?
When I type in a players name in the "search this topic" at the top I'm sure it isn't giving me all/most times any of a players posts?

Yes

Postreply and type "Vote" followed by any player you want, highlight it and select the red color. Post it. See what happens

[PepeAtila]

Thanks Dega.
/
Welcome back new Charle.
/
Razor, you should tell something because I am clueless about who I should vote.
/
Just when I was going to change my vote to Loose Canon, he evaporated ... It is clear he was aiming this.
Can somebody clear me about a roll group named Mason? I think I read it in some place and perhaps it is the conection between Pixar and Loose, can they be 3rd party? townie? scum?
/
Ragian perhaps you are right about my OMGUS vote, (it looks like just you realize about my vote), but really I was looking for a reason why they did choose 'old' Charle to kill and didn't realize about any other reason.

[DirtyDishSoap]

Masons are usually town aligned. It acts similar to cult, usually without a conversion though. I cant see Masons being in this. That's a pretty niche role(s).

I'd like to see Razor post as well before i change my vote.

[strike wolf]

Thinking I got bailed out by Loose was a total coincidence. I was actually about to claim until I got fast posted by that vote count which made me retract my claim, because something was going on with Loose's vote. But yes I would like to see Loose vote for someone today just to see what happens. And how does Loose not being able to be lynched today "confirm" him as town? Maybe he's got one action to use all game and he used it now since he was getting pressured?

Because such an ability for mafia is very much overpowered. Loose also used his abilty when there was 0 pressure on him, so I dont think it makes sense as mafia to do so.

Not a townie that's helping, though.

While I agree that it's an insanely powerful ability for mafia, I wouldny say he had no pressure on him. He had multiple people voting for him and a few others calling for him to prove that he was still voteless. I see three scenarios where this might be a scum role because at this point, Loose has just acted way too fishy for me not to consider the possibility.

1. Mafia is otherwise really underpowered/town is overpowered in comparison to mafia because town is very strong on comparison to mafia, Dega felt that they needed an extremely powerful role to balance out the differrbce.
2. He is either Sk or has some other 3p with a win con that involves finding a certain role or certain roles. In this case, the ability to avoid a lynch may just to be give a role that's usually at a disadvantage, especially in bigger games, a fighting chance or if his 3p role involves surviving somehow, it may be there just to help him live long enough to achieve his other objective. His behavior doesn't seem consistent with someone who has a survivor role but maybe he's just been more vocal because he's had the confidence that he could fall back on his 'smoke bomb' if things got too hairy.
3. The game just isn't balanced. Sorry Dega.

That said, unless this really isn't balanced at all, I can't see it being an ability scum could use more than once. Even with the side effect of being voteless.

I'll say that I actually agree with Son!c that Loose probably should be the target tomorrow barring a more promising lead. I feel that if Loose is scum than Extreme is more likely to also be scum. If he's Town/Serial Killer/3rd party then Son!c is slightly more likely to be scum.

Lot of posts in half a day, have pretty much read them but none that peaked my interest enough to quote directly. I'll say again, I was one of the ones who was adamantly against the wagon. It was started from nothing and I find it hard to blame Pix from not taking it all that seriously at first. It also felt like a lot of people were then just trying to justify it based on a joke comment Pix made at the beginning of the game which also didn't sit right with me. That said, I didn't have much of a vibe from Pix either way at the time but I can't say that he's done much to win me over since.

I've already stated my opinions on Raz earlier. He's been inactive since so I cant really say much has changed. He should probably get mod prodded and Bax at this point should either be replaced or modkilled. Has Drake posted recently? Will need to check.

[strike wolf]

Oh and masons are town aligned. They can sometimes have a recruiter like Cult but other times they're just a small group of townies who know each other and work together. In this game, a Mason group might be Superhero and Sidekick themed. So you could say, have Arthur and The Tick as a mason pairing. There are sometimes similar third party groups who aren't necessarily anti-town but usually they aren't called masons.

[SoN!c]

Basic conclusion : we need to hear Raz asap and we need to decide Pix making his claim y/n. I would vote for Pix making a claim is helping town. Would wanna hear fusi's idea on it. Perhaps trafa's too. Too many doubts otherwise..Pix is playing this as a pokergame i feel bluffing his way out? Then again im not that sure either.. its just a feel but boy i know i wanna know

[DirtyDishSoap]

I'm against making Pix claim just off the sake of a joke wagon in the previous day.

[SoN!c]

I'm against making Pix claim just off the sake of a joke wagon in the previous day.

Yes me too. But the fact remains there was something fishy going on and we could exclude the fishy part? If Pix checks town some character could protect him overnight?

Or do you think Raz is scum? Because that seems to be the only other choice here with Loose invulnerable to lynch today..

I wanna hear Raz too but i think it will cost time and we don't have that much time before town loses its advantage..correct me if im wrong but Raz did not post anything for an entire week in RL?

[traffic133]

my opinion is if you dont post something then your up for a lynching

i vote razorvich

[DirtyDishSoap]

I'm against making Pix claim just off the sake of a joke wagon in the previous day.

Yes me too. But the fact remains there was something fishy going on and we could exclude the fishy part? If Pix checks town some character could protect him overnight?

Or do you think Raz is scum? Because that seems to be the only other choice here with Loose invulnerable to lynch today..

I wanna hear Raz too but i think it will cost time and we don't have that much time before town loses its advantage..correct me if im wrong but Raz did not post anything for an entire week in RL?

The only thing i found fishy was the wagon itself and how many people jumped on for arbitrary reasons. Without looking back, i believe either Strike or Extreme made the comment on Razs time on said wagon? That has more merit than anything brought up against Pixar.

Do i think Raz is scum? Eh, I'm at a 50/50. I try not to use activity as an indicator for scum. It's hardly beneficial, and more often than not, just goes into a downhill game for town, quickly.

We currently do have the benefit of time? There is no deadline, this is D2 with one nightkill and some incredibly stupid shit happening. Loose is basically a bulletproof loon.

[Extreme Ways]

Thinking I got bailed out by Loose was a total coincidence. I was actually about to claim until I got fast posted by that vote count which made me retract my claim, because something was going on with Loose's vote. But yes I would like to see Loose vote for someone today just to see what happens. And how does Loose not being able to be lynched today "confirm" him as town? Maybe he's got one action to use all game and he used it now since he was getting pressured?

Because such an ability for mafia is very much overpowered. Loose also used his abilty when there was 0 pressure on him, so I dont think it makes sense as mafia to do so.

Not a townie that's helping, though.

While I agree that it's an insanely powerful ability for mafia, I wouldny say he had no pressure on him. He had multiple people voting for him and a few others calling for him to prove that he was still voteless. I see three scenarios where this might be a scum role because at this point, Loose has just acted way too fishy for me not to consider the possibility.

1. Mafia is otherwise really underpowered/town is overpowered in comparison to mafia because town is very strong on comparison to mafia, Dega felt that they needed an extremely powerful role to balance out the differrbce.
2. He is either Sk or has some other 3p with a win con that involves finding a certain role or certain roles. In this case, the ability to avoid a lynch may just to be give a role that's usually at a disadvantage, especially in bigger games, a fighting chance or if his 3p role involves surviving somehow, it may be there just to help him live long enough to achieve his other objective. His behavior doesn't seem consistent with someone who has a survivor role but maybe he's just been more vocal because he's had the confidence that he could fall back on his 'smoke bomb' if things got too hairy.
3. The game just isn't balanced. Sorry Dega.

That said, unless this really isn't balanced at all, I can't see it being an ability scum could use more than once. Even with the side effect of being voteless.

I'll say that I actually agree with Son!c that Loose probably should be the target tomorrow barring a more promising lead. I feel that if Loose is scum than Extreme is more likely to also be scum. If he's Town/Serial Killer/3rd party then Son!c is slightly more likely to be scum

I'm mainly responding due to the bolded stuff. I think you're mistaken because people plenty people have also been defending Loose D1. The pressure was on him - but it was to vote. From me included, even.

My personal tunnel is that Loose is still voteless but used his 'vote' to do this.

I also agree that activity is a poor meter for scumminess. However, this one doesnt sit right with me:

my opinion is if you dont post something then your up for a lynching

i vote razorvich

will post my vote when i home from work

We're going to need more than just votes. Give your opinion on Loose, give your opinion on the thought that "if Loose is scum, then EW is scum". I of course vehemently disagree with that one, but that helps people in figuring out your alignment.

I am currently voting alongside Pixar and traffic. It's making me reconsider my vote, but since I've walled Raz I want to at least hear something.

[Loose Canon]

Ok so I've found the sort by author button.
Sonic - IF you are a hero your not a very helpful one.
- at best that makes you an IFFY hero - at best!

I've read the posts by author to consider each of you.

[Extreme Ways]

Ok so I've found the sort by author button.
Sonic - IF you are a hero your not a very helpful one.
- at best that makes you an IFFY hero - at best!

I've read the posts by author to consider each of you.

You've read by author. Ok, you've considered us. Ok. Are you willing to share, too? Are you going to confirm/deny that your disappearance has something to do with your vote?

[Loose Canon]

Swang
1. You said a little bit in the lynch don't lynch discussion day 1 - but nothing really
2. You then posted about the Pixar suspicion but then concluded with a vote - I read it as a dummy vote - on Trafalgar.

3. THEREAFTER you've offered little except to use the shade already on me to appear to be offering something - but actually it amounted to nothing.
You did it in a way that made it seem you were posting something more substantial that it actually was and you had cover of someone else having cast the shade in the first instance.
You were happy with a red herring that made it appear that you were contributing.

For that Swang you get something red from me.


Vote; Swang918

[Extreme Ways]

Interesting how this vote counts now.

[degaston]

Vote Count:

• Razorvich : 4 (*Pixar*, Extreme Ways, Ragian, traffic133)
  swang918 : 2 (Loose Canon x 2)
  DirtyDishSoap : 1 (PepeAtila)
  PepeAtila : 1 (DirtyDishSoap)
  Loose Canon : 0 ()
  
  No Vote : 11 (Charle, Darin44, DukeHazzard, fusibaseball, General Bax, Maxleod, Razorvich, SoN!c, strike wolf, swang918, TrafalgarLaw01)

18 Alive, 10 votes needed to lynch

[Extreme Ways]

so Loose has double voting power after having 0 voting power.

This leads me back to thinking Loose is town and not 3p. 3p wouldn't have such a role, right?

[DukeHazzard]

so Loose has double voting power after having 0 voting power.

This leads me back to thinking Loose is town and not 3p. 3p wouldn't have such a role, right?

I think we need to also consider the smoke show. My take is that Loose has the ability to save himself by the smoke show. So is that a town type ability? I'm leaning that it is toward scum. Also think of the double vote. If a scum had that ability, used properly, someone could be at L-2 and Loose could double vote and hammer before anyone else could do anything about it. It still reads scum to me.

[strike wolf]

so Loose has double voting power after having 0 voting power.

This leads me back to thinking Loose is town and not 3p. 3p wouldn't have such a role, right?

I think we need to also consider the smoke show. My take is that Loose has the ability to save himself by the smoke show. So is that a town type ability? I'm leaning that it is toward scum. Also think of the double vote. If a scum had that ability, used properly, someone could be at L-2 and Loose could double vote and hammer before anyone else could do anything about it. It still reads scum to me.

It's an insanely powerful ability for scum to have. Too powerful to really balance. Therefore, I'm back to thinking Loose is not scum. There's almost no way to balance a scum with that much strength even if the double vote is only every other day.

[fusibaseball]

So he is in fact Vote Thief or something similar to it.

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Vote_Thief

Maybe Deg has customized the role so that instead of alternating between 1- and 2-vote days, Loose alternates between 0- and 2-vote days with the trade-off of getting the poof kicker. My vote counted earlier so I'm curious whose vote he stole (or nobody's, in which he's not a thief at all, just a totally separate role).

I agree that this seems OP if Scum but I'm just left confused by the timeline. Why POOF if you're just Town and not just show everyone you can double-vote?

[fusibaseball]

Basic conclusion : we need to hear Raz asap and we need to decide Pix making his claim y/n. I would vote for Pix making a claim is helping town. Would wanna hear fusi's idea on it. Perhaps trafa's too. Too many doubts otherwise..Pix is playing this as a pokergame i feel bluffing his way out? Then again im not that sure either.. its just a feel but boy i know i wanna know

We're sort of in an awkward spot now because no promising leads showed up from Night 1 and with how the Loose sequence has unfolded.

I'm probably voting Raz tomorrow/Wednesday if we still don't hear anything. I agree with DDS that you have to be careful not to misinterpret being quiet with scumminess. But I draw the line at not voting...said it in Prison, and I'll say it again...if you're not voting, I don't care if you're Town or not, your inactivity passively helps Mafia by not contributing any evidence and not helping lynch suspicious players. So if Bax or Raz don't vote, they're dead weight and that's not an exaggeration.

My main reservation is Loose using his double-vote for Swang. If Loose and Raz were aligned both Scum or Third Party, I don't think he would have already splayed his double-vote out in the open like he did but instead would save it for a more effective vote to contribute to a hammer. It's possible one is Third Party and the other Scum, but far more likely that at least one is Town. And if I had to pick between the 2, I'd pick Raz.

I'd like to hear Traf's thoughts as well. While not typically a vote initiator, he always has good insights and I've gotten a strong Town read off him (this started way back on my first Pixar vote when he immediately countered with his own independent thoughts rather than just voting Pixar behind me and I liked that).

Also Charle please continue to share your thoughts when you have them. Your kill may have been random as others have said but I find it very possible you were onto something Day 1 and that's why you were targeted. Getting knowledge and opinions into the thread is the most important thing.

TL;DR: I don't have anything better than Raz right now. Maybe Pepe or Max but that's a stretch. Max is always hard to pin down.