saxitoxin wrote:Dukasaur wrote:I debated Bob Rae during the (Edit: 19831985) provincial elections.
this sounds like it could be a good story; more info, please
1985, sorry.
I ran under the Libertarian banner in York South-Weston, which was also Bob Rae's home riding. He was provincial NDP leader at the time, so of course he was hopping around the province and trusting his home riding to take care of itself. During the first two All-Candidates meetings that were held in York South, Bob Rae was a no-show, and of course the Liberals and Conservatives, not having anything substantive to talk about, hammered him mercilessly about it. The night of the third All-Candidates meeting, most people thought that he would again give it a miss, but I guess he was feeling the heat, so he showed up, accompanied of course by the pursuit battalion of TV cameras.
York South is a brownfield area of Toronto, and hadn't recovered from the 1983 recession (it never would recover) so of course the hot-button topic of the year was stimulus spending and brownfield rejuvenation. There were some question about the
other hot-buttons: separate school funding and abortion, but those didn't produce any real excitement in our area like they did in other places.
There were several questions about stimulus spending. The Liberals and Conservatives delivered their usual semantically-null canned soundbites. Bob Rae was in his element. He went over the 3-minute limit waxing eloquent about Franklin Roosevelt and the New Deal. I spoke next. I spoke next. Of course I gave the textbook Libertarian line that stimulus spending is illusory. Real economic growth comes from tax relief and putting money back in the hands of the people; not from letting the parasites in parliament piss it away on phoney job creation schemes. I had time left over though, so I responded to Bob Rae's points about the New Deal, pointing out that in 1941, after 8 years of "job creation" the real American unemployment rate was essentially the same as in 1933. Only WWII pulled FDR's chestnuts out of the fire and let him send his unemployed men overseas.
Bob Rae burst in "ABSOLUTELY INCORRECT!" It wasn't a debate format. It was simply take the prepared questions, take turns answering them, and no back-and-forth. Still, Bob Rae was a legitimate celebrity, and the moderator was willing to let him have some leeway. It was pure lucky coincidence that just that very day I had been reading one of Leonard Read's articles about the fraudulent math underlying New Deal job creation, so it was all fresh in my mind and I had lots of facts and figures to cite. Bob Rae really worships FDR; I really despise him. The moderator wasn't going to interfere, so for a beautiful couple of minutes it was just pure head-to-head fuck-you-and-your-horse debate, and then we sat back and everything returned to the normal level of banality.
The Liberal and the Conservative and the fifth candidate (an almost incoherent woman who spoke with a thick foreign accent and called herself an "independent liberal") all just sat there slack-jawed. Liberals and Conservatives are, of course, trained seals who just parrot pre-packaged soundbites and never, ever, engage in any honest discussion of the issues. More than that, though, we were breaking the cardinal rule in Canadian politics to never mention anything that happens south of the border, and they weren't about to go down that road.
All in all, it was a great night!