Failing to Reconciled Nomad Because He’s Scared

[Bernie Sanders]

Atta boy!

Please continue...

I will, thanks.

I meant Nomad, not you.

[NomadPatriot]

I would argue we need a balance, and their are times where affirmative action (AA) policies are/have been necessary.I would also argue that there are times where they have gone too far.

Affirmative Action entails the proponent of the Action thinks a Race ( typically a Minority) is not equal to another race ( typically a Majority) therefore the "inferior race" (not equal too...) needs special treatment...

all races are equal, it's 2019...
if you think Affirmative Actions for minorities of color ( or women....) are still required in today's society.. you have not experienced today's society.. ..

inferring one race is not able to succeed on their own merits.. that they can not build themselves up.. that there needs to be 'special actions' taken to make them equal only show that the proponents of said action ( affirmative action) are viewing the situation from a racist standpoint... that the 'special needs race' is inferior...

Since ‘white’ people are still the majority and still hold the vast majority of the political and economic power, then what I’m primarily discussing at the moment is Racism from the ‘white’ majority; and towards the ‘colored’ minority.

provide any examples of White Racism towards any Colored Minority within the past 10 or even 20 years that is of any national relevance. ( and good gosh do not even mention f-ing Charlottesville...….) because I can provide a truckload of links & videos about 'white people' being demoralized

Though I agree that you have to be aware of (and we can discuss) what is sometimes called “Reverse Racism”... or policies that so favor minorities that they harm the majority. I would like to continue calling this Reverse Racism for now, even though I recognize that this misnomer downplays the impact; and from the victim’s point of view Reverse Racism is just Racism.

racism is racism.. there is no 'Reverse Racism"..
let's try that notion with other things:
Rape is a man raping a woman.. 'Reverse Rape ' would be when a woman rapes a man. because only men can rape..

let's dig deeper.. if a Latino is being racist towards an African American.. what is the reverse racism in that scenario..? the African American being racist towards the Latino..?
suggesting there is such a thing as "Reverse Racism " entails only white people can be racist. and if a minority displays hatred towards whites or any other race who is not white. .then that is the opposite of racism.. called Reverse Racism... because only whites can be racist...
try having a discussion about Racism and take white people out of the equation.. does the ideal of racism still work for you...?

[DoomYoshi]

all races are equal, it's 2019...

Equal in which way?

------

"Reverse racism" is so-called because racism is disdain of "races" that are worse off in the socioeconomic ladder. Reverse racism is simply racism up the socioeconomic ladder. In the case of the Latino on African-American, that is simply normal racism.

[NomadPatriot]

all races are equal, it's 2019...

Equal in which way?

------

"Reverse racism" is so-called because racism is disdain of "races" that are worse off in the socioeconomic ladder. Reverse racism is simply racism up the socioeconomic ladder. In the case of the Latino on African-American, that is simply normal racism.

equal in every way applicable to a generalized race. how do you think races are not equal in today's society?

-----

so .. what you perceive as 'racism ' is a disdain for a race that is lower on a socioeconomic ladder.. but Latinos & African Americans are on the same rung of that ladder.. ?
what does Socioeconomic status have to do with race...?

Socioeconomic status is the social standing or class of an individual or group. It is often measured as a combination of education, income and occupation. it is not measured based on race or gender or location..

but if you want to apply socioeconomic status to race. ok.. let's se how that would work out..

- minorities are given preferential treatment in many aspects of modern society as far as hiring for job positions..
- laws are created to protect them based solely on their skin color
- affirmative action gives them extended extra benefits over other races. ( mainly white people) in regards to college acceptance allowing them a advantage to get a higher education thus higher paying jobs
- society treats them with a special nurturing care not extended to the majority race. ( mainly whites)..

so .. Socioeconomically .. Minority races ( people of color) are on a higher rung then the Majority Race (people of white). thus . by your own logic, anything a Minority would do in the racist field would be racism.. and anything the Majority would do in the racist field would be Reverse Racism since the Majority would have to climb up the Socioeconomic Ladder in order to extend Racism towards them

personally I prefer all races are equal.. & any racism is just plain racism.. ill regardless of which race does it

[DoomYoshi]

all races are equal, it's 2019...

Equal in which way?

------

"Reverse racism" is so-called because racism is disdain of "races" that are worse off in the socioeconomic ladder. Reverse racism is simply racism up the socioeconomic ladder. In the case of the Latino on African-American, that is simply normal racism.

equal in every way applicable to a generalized race. how do you think races are not equal in today's society?

You haven't actually listed any ways in which they are equal. Until you give a single point of equality, I won't answer your question.

so .. what you perceive as 'racism ' is a disdain for a race that is lower on a socioeconomic ladder.. but Latinos & African Americans are on the same rung of that ladder.. ?
what does Socioeconomic status have to do with race...?

Latinos and African Americans are not at the same rung. During segregation, latinos could drink from white people fountains, etc.

Both socioeconomic status and race are entirely manmade concepts, with no relation to scientific proof. So that's one thing they have to do with each other.

Another reason I bring up socioeconomic status is because there is a distinction between generic racism (e.g. Italians are good at masonry) and racism that keeps people down. Usually people are only interested in the racism that brings or keeps people down. Nobody protests my appreciation of Italian cement driveways.

- minorities are given preferential treatment in many aspects of modern society as far as hiring for job positions..
- laws are created to protect them based solely on their skin color
- affirmative action gives them extended extra benefits over other races. ( mainly white people) in regards to college acceptance allowing them a advantage to get a higher education thus higher paying jobs
- society treats them with a special nurturing care not extended to the majority race. ( mainly whites)..

None of those things mean they are higher on the socioeconomic ladder. Perhaps it's a new idea, but the way I think of it is... you are throwing a party... who do you invite? Top of the list is usually people like royalty, PotUSA, the Pope (the social side) or billionaires, Bill Gates, etc (the economic side). I'm not going to pick somebody because "he was given preferential treatment at the police department when they hired an intern". That doesn't raise someone up the ladder at all. It might raise them up slightly (since public servants can get better pay than other equivalent blue collar workers).

[NomadPatriot]

- equal is equal. there is no list,
- Italian is a nationality, not a race
- throwing a party has nothing to do with socioeconomics being applied to racism, people invite whoever they think would enjoy the party
- you said " Reverse racism is simply racism up the socioeconomic ladder. In the case of the Latino on African-American, that is simply normal racism." so if there is no up or down on the ladder pertaining to a Latino vs African American racism situation. .then by your logic.. they are on the same rung of your ladder
- if you think Race is a manmade concept and has nothing to do with science.. you are dumber then I thought... because biology & genetics are science
- saying Italians are good at masonry is not racism.. again, Italian is a nationality. if a group of peoples in general have passed down technical skills over generations and are good at masonry that would have nothing to do with racism even if the skill set was applied to a actual race.. nobody protests you saying it because saying it has nothing to do with racism... saying someone from a certain country is good at something is called a compliment...

anything else you need me to destroy you on..?

[DoomYoshi]

No, continue on.

Teach me, oh wise one, what are the races according to biology and genetics, which are science?

[hotfire]

I still think nomad is a troll and does not believe wholeheartedly what he posts. He just posts shit to stir the pot and try to win an argument that he heard from some shady source. I will even give you his troll formula.

1. Start the post with a wide crazy idea that will upset someone somewhere
2. Wait for a response
3. Narrow the idea, insult and add a GIF
4. Wait for a response
5. Repeat 3 (narrow the hoop the other person must jump through, add a new insult and GIF or two)
6. Wait for a response
7. Refuse to admit the legitimacy of their argument, rehash your narrow hoop, insult and add a GIF of victory
8. Repeat 7 indefinitely until the other posters tire of your stubborness and stop arguing
9. Claim victory a final time and add a GIF or two

Go ahead and test this formula in his many OPs. See the light.

[jimboston]

PLEASE DO NOT DERAIL MY THREAD WITH AGGRESSIVE WORDS AND UNFAIR DEBATE TACTICS1

I’m talking to all of you kids!

[hotfire]

PLEASE DO NOT DERAIL MY THREAD WITH AGGRESSIVE WORDS AND UNFAIR DEBATE TACTICS1

I’m talking to all of you kids!

My post is on point according to the name of this thread. My opinion has not changed.

[NomadPatriot]

No, continue on.

Teach me, oh wise one, what are the races according to biology and genetics, which are science?

you simply can take a genetic ancestry DNA test to determine your racial heritage.
~ Caucasoid
~ Mongoloid
~ Negroid
~ Australoid

humans can be broken down into sub-races referred to as Ethnic Groups within those 4 races..
some examples of Subraces / Ethinc Groups include:

- Caucasoid Subraces / Ethnic Groups: Aryans, Semitic ,Hamitic, Nordic, Mediterranean, Dinaric, Alpine, Arabid, East Baltic, Turanid, Iranid and Armenoid.
- Negroid Subraces / Ethnic Groups: ~ Nilotic, Bantu, Sudanic, Pygmy, Khoisan


… in modern day society Humans decided to make it easier and refer to skin color for quick reference of someone's race or referencing them in regard to which continental region they appear to be from
.. but the only way to determine the exact Racial Heritage of an individual is with a Genetic DNA Test..

Genetic DNA Tests are what people refer to as a Science..


your 9th grade Biology class is concluded.

[Jdsizzleslice]

It would be nice to actually have a discussion about such things without being told to GFY because of a disagreement...

[NomadPatriot]

I still think nomad is a troll and does not believe wholeheartedly what he posts. He just posts shit to stir the pot and try to win an argument that he heard from some shady source. I will even give you his troll formula.

1. Start the post with a wide crazy idea that will upset someone somewhere
2. Wait for a response
3. Narrow the idea, insult and add a GIF
4. Wait for a response
5. Repeat 3 (narrow the hoop the other person must jump through, add a new insult and GIF or two)
6. Wait for a response
7. Refuse to admit the legitimacy of their argument, rehash your narrow hoop, insult and add a GIF of victory
8. Repeat 7 indefinitely until the other posters tire of your stubborness and stop arguing
9. Claim victory a final time and add a GIF or two

Go ahead and test this formula in his many OPs. See the light.

Hotfire seems weirdly obsessed with me.
he has even studied me to the point he has developed a Calculated Formula on how to interact with me.

[hotfire]

I still think nomad is a troll and does not believe wholeheartedly what he posts. He just posts shit to stir the pot and try to win an argument that he heard from some shady source. I will even give you his troll formula.

1. Start the post with a wide crazy idea that will upset someone somewhere
2. Wait for a response
3. Narrow the idea, insult and add a GIF
4. Wait for a response
5. Repeat 3 (narrow the hoop the other person must jump through, add a new insult and GIF or two)
6. Wait for a response
7. Refuse to admit the legitimacy of their argument, rehash your narrow hoop, insult and add a GIF of victory
8. Repeat 7 indefinitely until the other posters tire of your stubborness and stop arguing
9. Claim victory a final time and add a GIF or two

Go ahead and test this formula in his many OPs. See the light.

Hotfire seems weirdly obsessed with me.
he has even studied me to the point he has developed a Calculated Formula on how to interact with me.

reread it. it is how you interact w others not vice versa

[jimboston]

I would argue we need a balance, and their are times where affirmative action (AA) policies are/have been necessary.I would also argue that there are times where they have gone too far.

Affirmative Action entails the proponent of the Action thinks a Race ( typically a Minority) is not equal to another race ( typically a Majority) therefore the "inferior race" (not equal too...) needs special treatment...

all races are equal, it's 2019...
if you think Affirmative Actions for minorities of color ( or women....) are still required in today's society.. you have not experienced today's society.. ..

inferring one race is not able to succeed on their own merits.. that they can not build themselves up.. that there needs to be 'special actions' taken to make them equal only show that the proponents of said action ( affirmative action) are viewing the situation from a racist standpoint... that the 'special needs race' is inferior...

So Nomad, I am TRYING to discuss with you fairly and reasonably. I would ask two things...
1) You give me the same consideration.
2) You ignore (in this thread) posters who are attacking you and who are not being reasonable.

Now, to reply...

FROM PROPONENTS POINT OF VIEW... Affirmative Action (AA) programs are not put in place because they feel the beneficiaries of these programs are INFERIOR. Proponents of AA believe that the beneficiaries of the programs have been unfairly disadvantaged (by a variety of factors). Proponents of AA see these programs as a counterweight to help balance or even out the scales.

It’s perfectly reasonable to disagree with the accuracy of this belief. It’s perfectly fair to say “the disadvantages are no longer applicable” or “the disadvantages are self-imposed” or “I see plenty of people (of all races) come from disadvantageous situations and succeed... therefore those who don’t succeed are not trying hard enough... and maybe these programs give them a crutch or excuse that is detrimental in the long run.” These are valid debatable points.

It’s not fair or reasonable to claim that proponents of AA see the beneficiaries as inferior.

—> Please reply specifically to this, and let me know if you agree or disagree with these statements.

My personal opinion on AA Programs is that they have definitely been needed in the past, and are still probably useful in some circumstances, but are probably too widely used today and should all have ‘sunset’ policies; or set times that they will expire unless additional action is taken. I don’t think they should exist indefinitely.

Related, but not exactly the same thing is ‘the welfare state’... which applies to all races. I definitely think the welfare system is broken and its’ current design perpetuates its’ continued existence and its’ continued need across multiple generations. This subject is probably best discussed in a whole separate thread.

Since ‘white’ people are still the majority and still hold the vast majority of the political and economic power, then what I’m primarily discussing at the moment is Racism from the ‘white’ majority; and towards the ‘colored’ minority.

provide any examples of White Racism towards any Colored Minority within the past 10 or even 20 years that is of any national relevance. ( and good gosh do not even mention f-ing Charlottesville...….) because I can provide a truckload of links & videos about 'white people' being demoralized

You and I both know I’m not going to do this.

I don’t even know what you mean by “of national relevance’ that’s a disclaimer that makes me finding any evidence impossible, because you’d deny that what I post is of ‘national relevance’. Again, you are retreating to your “i’m cornered” tactics, while I am still trying to discuss the subject reasonably. Racism does not have to be actions of ‘national relevance’. Individual actions can impact other individuals in a negative way and the cumulative effects of those actions can be of national significance. If enough individual actions follow a pattern then, as a nation, it’s reasonable to ask “why” and “Is there anything we can do about it?”

Are you denying the existence of racism against black people in this country?
This is a real question.

If you deny this even occurs then I either need to stop talking about it, or find some evidence to change your mind.

—> Please reply specifically to this, and let me know if deny the existence of racism perpetuated by white people against black people.

Though I agree that you have to be aware of (and we can discuss) what is sometimes called “Reverse Racism”... or policies that so favor minorities that they harm the majority. I would like to continue calling this Reverse Racism for now, even though I recognize that this misnomer downplays the impact; and from the victim’s point of view Reverse Racism is just Racism.

racism is racism.. there is no 'Reverse Racism"..

Ok... did you even read what I wrote?

I specifically said “from the victims point of view Reverse Racism is just Racism.

I specifically already acknowledged the point you are making. I just asked that we continue to call it Reverse Racism for ease of discussion... not because it’s really different.

let's try that notion with other things:
Rape is a man raping a woman.. 'Reverse Rape ' would be when a woman rapes a man. because only men can rape..

Rape of a man by a woman... I call that fun!

Seriously... Reverse Racism is just shorthand. I acknowledge that it’s essentially the same as Racism... and I further acknowledge that the name “Reverse Racism” makes it somehow sound ‘not as bad’... which is a valid reason to resist using the term. I will say that policies like Affirmative Action policies or “racial quotas” can result in outcomes that are detrimental towards white Americans (or sometimes other groups).... but I deny that the original purpose or intent of these policies are such they ‘want’ to harm white Americans.

You can argue that ‘intent’ is ambiguous and not important, only the result is important... and I understand this view. This view is a core issue... and goes back to world-view and life experiences and drives a lot of the backlash and support Trump is getting. The Left/Liberals should pay more attention to these types of concerns. I definitely see how many white Americans can feel that the Left has abandoned them.

let's dig deeper.. if a Latino is being racist towards an African American.. what is the reverse racism in that scenario..? the African American being racist towards the Latino..?
suggesting there is such a thing as "Reverse Racism " entails only white people can be racist. and if a minority displays hatred towards whites or any other race who is not white. .then that is the opposite of racism.. called Reverse Racism... because only whites can be racist...

I think I’ve explained myself well... so we don’t need to give more example to prove the same point.

Reverse Racism is shorthand... if you can’t stomach the term we’ll say “racism against whites” from now on... RAW instead of RR.

try having a discussion about Racism and take white people out of the equation.. does the ideal of racism still work for you...?

The ideal of racism... I don’t know what that means.

The idea of racism... yes. I am fully capable of understanding all that you have said and I know it’s not only a white-harming-black thing, and that it can involve many variables of one-race pitted against another. This point has been made by you here and in many other threads.

This discussion, from my side, has primarily been about ‘standard’ racism in the USA which MOST would say is racism against African Americans.

I understand other types of racism exist... and these are definitely problems and shouldn’t be accepted... and to the victim THAT is the only racism that matters.

That all said, your actions pointing this out again and again suggests something that I want to understand about you and your world view. I won’t deny your view as invalid, as your view is your view and it’s based on your life experiences... and I can’t deny your life experiences. That said, it seems to me that you feel racism against white people... either by black people or by white people who may perpetuate it for their own purposes... is a bigger problem in this country than racism against black people.

Is that your view?

It’s fine if it is... but we can’t discuss the subject of ‘race problems’ if don’t understand each other’s views.

I acknowledge that racism can be perpetrated on/by anyone... but in general I feel black Americans get discriminated against more than white Americans.... but if your experience tells you something different it would be good to know.

[jimboston]

PLEASE DO NOT DERAIL MY THREAD WITH AGGRESSIVE WORDS AND UNFAIR DEBATE TACTICS1

I’m talking to all of you kids!

My post is on point according to the name of this thread. My opinion has not changed.

You are actually directly off-point.... but whatever.

I’m mainly annoyed with DoomYoshi attacked NP.
If he’s attacked he’s not going to feel comfortable to open up and we won’t be able to have a free discussion.

[jimboston]

It would be nice to actually have a discussion about such things without being told to GFY because of a disagreement...

I’m trying.

[hotfire]

PLEASE DO NOT DERAIL MY THREAD WITH AGGRESSIVE WORDS AND UNFAIR DEBATE TACTICS1

I’m talking to all of you kids!

My post is on point according to the name of this thread. My opinion has not changed.

You are actually directly off-point.... but whatever.

I’m mainly annoyed with DoomYoshi attacked NP.
If he’s attacked he’s not going to feel comfortable to open up and we won’t be able to have a free discussion.

I am trying to change your opinion of NP. Read some of his OP through fruition and tell me my formula is inaccurate.

[DoomYoshi]

No, continue on.

Teach me, oh wise one, what are the races according to biology and genetics, which are science?

you simply can take a genetic ancestry DNA test to determine your racial heritage.
~ Caucasoid
~ Mongoloid
~ Negroid
~ Australoid

humans can be broken down into sub-races referred to as Ethnic Groups within those 4 races..
some examples of Subraces / Ethinc Groups include:

- Caucasoid Subraces / Ethnic Groups: Aryans, Semitic ,Hamitic, Nordic, Mediterranean, Dinaric, Alpine, Arabid, East Baltic, Turanid, Iranid and Armenoid.
- Negroid Subraces / Ethnic Groups: ~ Nilotic, Bantu, Sudanic, Pygmy, Khoisan


… in modern day society Humans decided to make it easier and refer to skin color for quick reference of someone's race or referencing them in regard to which continental region they appear to be from
.. but the only way to determine the exact Racial Heritage of an individual is with a Genetic DNA Test..

Genetic DNA Tests are what people refer to as a Science..


your 9th grade Biology class is concluded.

So there are only 4 races, or all the ethnic groups races? What about people who are mutts, what race are they? How can I prove that using a genetics test?

However, you said that all the races are equal, so there would be no way to distinguish them using a genetics test. Therefore, they aren't equal. Unless you live in a fantasy world where "equal" means "different".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equivalence_relation

Also, in what way does that constitute science? What are the falsifiable hypotheses involved in determining a racial heritage?

[NomadPatriot]

sorry Jim.. I am not spending 20 minutes reading that dissertation.

- I will gloss over it and simplify..
Affirmative Action would be great if it was focused on a class of people & not a Ethnic Group or Gender.. example - help the poor.. whoever is poor gets help

- racism is Racism .. all Ethnic Groups have Racists within their ranks..
Racism is not a 'white on everyone else' phenomenon.. but you seem to only be concerned with White Racism..

- you referred to reverse racism as if it is a thing. it is not.. so why bring it up...

- quit inferring I can argue things.. If I feel the need to argue something I will.. you are attempting to predict what you think I will respond with.. creating a narrative that you are arguing with yourself over..

- when you say instead of reverse racism we will say 'racism against white' means you still only think whites can be racist. .anything other then that is the reverse of racism.. …" if I cannot stomach calling it Reverse racism" .. no. racism is racism.. take whites out of the equation of racism.. can you still reference the terminology Reverse Racism.. if you cannot. then you think only whites can be racist.. any other racism is the opposite of that

- Standard Racism.. ? "normal racism" is whites being racist.. this is your position. you 'understand other forms of racism exist'.. but too you. .Racism is white people hating other groups.. that is 'standard racism.. the norm.. any other Racism is either Reverse Racism or 'another form of racism'.. you have made this very clear.. you obviously can not grasp the concept Racism is Racism.. you refuse to apply the actual definition of racism to society..

[DoomYoshi]

It’s not fair or reasonable to claim that proponents of AA see the beneficiaries as inferior.

They don't, but they should. It's a logical conclusion that cannot be escaped (given the premises).

That's a general statement. Trying to help someone implies that you believe you are superior to them, at least in modern individualistic culture.

[NomadPatriot]

doom doesn't understand genetics..
doesn't understand what subraces are..
doesn't understand what Ethnic groups are
doesn't understand the difference between a nationality & a race
doesn't understand the notion all races are equal when applied to modern day society..

someone else explain it too him. if that's even possible

[DoomYoshi]

Yes please. If only there were some geneticists in this forum, I could probably learn something.

If only somebody would show me a single area in which races are equal, then I could know what is even happening.

[HitRed]

DY hasn't posted this much in a long time.

[NomadPatriot]

Yes please. If only there were some geneticists in this forum, I could probably learn something.

If only somebody would show me a single area in which races are equal, then I could know what is even happening.

here I will give you 20 examples of "all races are equal in 2019":

all races are equally allowed to own pets.. there is no discrimination on pet ownership.. thus in the pet ownership field.. all races are equal. .
same can be applied too: Car Ownership, being able to walk down sidewalks, ability to buy clothes, interaction in online websites, farming, getting a haircut, buying groceries, being a movie fan, ordering pizza, marriage, divorce, having children, bird watching, collecting coins, being 1st in line on Black Friday, fishing, hunting, going on vacation, being an athlete

equality of the races does not mean people are the same race... it means all races are equally able to do the exact same things..
some get advantages via Affirmative Action. some get disadvantages.. via Affirmative Action.
-------
here Doom.. educate yourself..