THE OFFICIAL CC CONQUEROR’S CUP 4

[jetsetwilly]

Please refer to this thread for discussion on the recent officiation of the CC4. Thank you, --rds

Welcome to the Fourth Annual OFFICIAL CC CONQUEROR’S CUP!!

Rewards

The Conquerors Cup is now an Official CC Clan Event and as such the CD's have been able to secure premium prizes to award to the winning clan, 1 month per eligible clan member and we will also be awarding overall Medals to 1st, 2nd and 3rd place Clans.

Brackets TBD


Clan wars threads



Sign up date TBA

General Layout

This will be a multi-clan, bracket style, single elimination clan war tournament. I am guessing the challenge will consist of 30-40 clans (possibly more). We will take however many sign up as long as they meet eligibility. Clans will be seeded before the tournament starts. The bracket will be set up so it is 1v32, 2v31, 3v30, etc. If we have more than 32 clans sign up, then as many play-in games matches will take place as we need to get a 32 clan bracket by the lowest seeded clans. A layout of a bracket can be seen in the 2nd post below. The winner of the finals will be the winner of the Conqueror's Cup. The loser of the finals will take 2nd place. The two clans who lose the semi finals will play a clan war the same as the finals for 3rd place.

OR (By virtue of vote in CDF)

A Random Draw
& other associated schema as proposed by interested parties

Options here:

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 0#p4107937

Seedings

After sign-ups conclude, seedings will be given out. The seedings will be determined by the latest F400 Rankings found here http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 8&t=159580. I will ask the person running those to edit them right before we start.

Or (if any desire for a vote, since Power Rankings were often used previously)

BG's Coaches Poll

Eligibility

Clan Eligibility
To sign up for the Conqueror's Cup, each clan must meet the following criteria.

• -Must be members of the CDF
  
  

To sign up, the clan leader must post the clan name in this thread along with a 1st and 2nd contact.

Player Eligibility
We will be playing with an amended "cup tied" rule. The rules will be as follows:

• -If a player plays for a clan in a given round, they are cup-tied for that round and cannot play for another clan in that round
  -If the old clan of a player loses the round in which the player has played, that player is considered "eliminated" with their old clan and cannot play for another clan for the rest of the tournament
  -If the old clan of a player wins the last round in which the player has played with them, then they are not considered cup-tied at the conclusion of that war and are free to play with any other clan at the beginning of the next round of the tournament
  
  OR
  
  Player is cup-tied for only 1 round after joining a new clan
  
  OR
  
  Other feasible suggestions as mentioned
  

Every clan will need to post a numbered list of all of their active members that can easily be copied and pasted before the start of their first war, for example:

• 1. Chuuuuck
  2. Chariot of Fire
  3. Dako
  ...etc.

I will add these lists to each clans spoiler in the third post for a quick and easy way for clans to copy these lists to tally game totals and also a record of which players started with which clans

Clan Wars

The play-in clan wars (games before the round of 32) as well as the first round of the Conqueror's Cup will use the following format:

• - 41 total games
  - 12 doubles
  - 14 triples
  - 14 quads
  - Each clan member can only participate in 15 games per clan war

Clan wars in the round of 16 and the quarter finals of the Conqueror's Cup will use the following format:

• - 61 total games
  - 20 doubles
  - 20 triples
  - 20 quads
  - Each clan member can only participate in 20 games per clan war

The semi-finals and finals of the Conqueror's Cup will use the following format:

• - 60 total games OR 80 Games
  - 20 doubles
  - 20 triples
  - 20 quads
  - Each clan member can only participate in 20 games per clan war
  

Any players can play in the tie-breaker games in the semi finals and finals even if they have already played in their allotted number of games for that clan war, however, no player can play in more than 2 of the games. Maps cannot be reused in the tie breaker games.

As has been allowed in the past, each clan war can adjust the rules slightly to their liking if both clans agree on the adjusted rules before any games are started and they get my approval.


Settings

• -Trench Warfare games limited to a certain percentage OR No Trench OR Mutual Agreement by Clans
  -30 Rounds OR No Limit OR Mutual Agreement by Clans
  -Fog of War Rule OR No FoW rule OR Mutual Agreement by Clans
  -For the Final or Semi, In case of a tie, there will be a 7 game tie breaker with each clan choosing three games of any game type and settings. The last game will be Quads on World 2.1, sunny, chained, no spoils. OR Only 1 Game Tiebreaker in latter rounds AND/OR Trips on Random (other game-type for tiebreak) etc
  - Each map can only be used twice per clan per clan war but can only be used once per game type (i.e. once for triples and once for quads) OR 1 per War/Tournament? (Already Voted down by CDF?)
  -Nukes OR No Nukes OR Mutual Agreement by Clans (Already Vote Passed in CDF? - For League only?)
  -There will be no freestyle, speed, manual deployments & beta map games allowed
  - Each clan will pick the map and settings for exactly half of the games. Excluding the tiebreaker

Miscellaneous

Miscellaneous
Any deemed abuse should be brought to the attention of the Cup Organisers immediately.

The 12 hour Fog of war rule will not be enforced automatically. If two clans wish to use it (as a gentleman's agreement) then this must be done in advance of the round in which they play one another (there will be no penalties for not using it nor will there be any enforcement of the gentleman's agreement by cup officials if it is breached). Games will not be re-made and results will not be changed.

Deliberately timing out in Escalating and Nuclear games to avoid taking a spoil will not be tolerated by any players.

This is not a common occurrence and we do not expect to see it happen at all but a rule should be in place to prevent abuse.

If a team breaks this rule the game must be re-made. (unless the wronged clan want the game to stand)

If a clan repeatedly breaks the rule then an escalating scale of punishment will apply.


Decisions of the cup organisers are final.

Clans submitting entry to the cup are deemed to have agreed to the rules.

Organization

For each clan war, the higher ranked clan will setup a thread to run that particular match. PLEASE PUT "[CC4]" (STANDS FOR CONQUEROR'S CUP 4) AT THE BEGINNING OF THE TITLE FOR EACH CLAN WAR. All games should be created using gaming privileges for each clan war. All game links should be kept up in the thread created for that clan match. Games should be sent 10 at a time from each clan (20 games total) for each round and sent by the date specified on the schedule.

In each clan challenge thread. A list of players participating for each clan should be kept up along with a running tally of how many games each player has played in. If someone feels a player has violated the number of games they are allowed to participate in, please bring it to my attention. If they are found in violation, the opposing team will get to pick any games that the offending player was in from the last batch played equal to the number of games the went over the limit to restart without that player participating.

When games are sent, they must already be created and fully joined by the home team. I should be copied in the private message sending each clans home games. Once home games are sent, the away clan has 5 full days to fill the games. If your opponent is late on either sending/joining home games or joining games please notify me immediately. There will be some leniency on running late, I will work out a date with the clans involved and set a date that games must be sent/joined by. If a clan is still late in sending/joining home games or joining games they will forfeit 1 game per day late. The opposing team will choose which game they forfeit from the batch of games in question (i.e. if a clan sends their home games 1 day late, the opposing team will choose one of those games the late clan forfeits once they receive them). I will be checking the forums for every clan match to make sure they are being kept up properly, sent and joined on time, and the playing rules are being upheld. However, if any clan feels their opponents have broken a rule they should bring it to my attention immediately.

PLEASE NOTE THIS IS STILL A HOLDING POST AND WE WILL UPDATE THE FINAL FORMAT AS IT IS DECIDED

All Agenda's can be conveyed to your respective Clan Representative as a feasible topic for voting in CDF!

[chapcrap]

The Conquerors Cup is now an Official CC Clan Event and as such the CD's have been able to secure premium prizes to award to the winning clan, 1 month per eligible clan member and we will also be awarding overall Medals to 1st, 2nd and 3rd place Clans.

Is this in addition to the medals already given for winning the wars? Like a super special medal?

Games should be sent 10 at a time from each clan (20 games total) for each round and sent by the date specified on the schedule.

Can this be negotiated by clans to do more games earlier? Usually in a 41 game war we would do 11 and 9, that's why I ask.

In each clan challenge thread. A list of players participating for each clan should be kept up along with a running tally of how many games each player has played in.

This isn't something that I have done in past wars. Should we do this for ALL wars or is this just a CC4 thing?

Thanks.

[Bruceswar]

The Conquerors Cup is now an Official CC Clan Event and as such the CD's have been able to secure premium prizes to award to the winning clan, 1 month per eligible clan member and we will also be awarding overall Medals to 1st, 2nd and 3rd place Clans.

Is this in addition to the medals already given for winning the wars? Like a super special medal?

Games should be sent 10 at a time from each clan (20 games total) for each round and sent by the date specified on the schedule.

Can this be negotiated by clans to do more games earlier? Usually in a 41 game war we would do 11 and 9, that's why I ask.

In each clan challenge thread. A list of players participating for each clan should be kept up along with a running tally of how many games each player has played in.

This isn't something that I have done in past wars. Should we do this for ALL wars or is this just a CC4 thing?

Thanks.

1. Medals will be the same as before right but 2nd and 3rd now will get medals. We hope to use super medals at a later date like the site wide cup uses.

2. You can send more than 10 in the first batch if both clans agree. At least 10 must be sent.

3. It would be nice to have it done in each thread, but for now doing this in CC4 for now.

[IcePack]

So under CD, who is the primary contact for CCup?

I had already discussed and made arrangements thru Dako, and now I'll have to do the same with...? Jet?

[Bruceswar]

You can talk with any CD. We are all open to contact.

[niMic]

I always wondered. Is this the cup of the conqueror or the cup of the conquerors?

[Foxglove]

Seedings
After sign-ups conclude, seedings will be given out. The seedings will be determined by the latest F400 Rankings found here http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 8&t=159580. I will ask the person running those to edit them right before we start.

Or (if any desire for a vote, since Power Rankings were often used previously)

BG's Coaches Poll

An opinion poll? The only reason the Power Rankings were used originally is because we didn't have a numerical results-based system that anyone could agree on. If you go with BG's Coaches poll, how will you seed all of the clans that don't make his list? Randomly? Or are you trying to make a point of listing options that can be voted on, no matter how ridiculous?

Option 1: Multi-year numerical results-based system accepted by all clans
Option 2: Opinion poll that ranks half of the existing clans

[Leehar]

Seedings
After sign-ups conclude, seedings will be given out. The seedings will be determined by the latest F400 Rankings found here http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 8&t=159580. I will ask the person running those to edit them right before we start.

Or (if any desire for a vote, since Power Rankings were often used previously)

BG's Coaches Poll

An opinion poll? The only reason the Power Rankings were used originally is because we didn't have a numerical results-based system that anyone could agree on. If you go with BG's Coaches poll, how will you seed all of the clans that don't make his list? Randomly? Or are you trying to make a point of listing options that can be voted on, no matter how ridiculous?

Option 1: Multi-year numerical results-based system accepted by all clans
Option 2: Opinion poll that ranks half of the existing clans

Sorry, I didn't imagine there would be much desire for it, but thought I would put it out there in case it did perk anyone's interest as a viable alternative.

But thanks for shutting me down so nicely

I also thought it could be interesting in the case of say Atlantis. They have pretty much taken off all that was BoFM, who had well-established themselves as a Top 20 clan, but the F400 will essentially be putting them nearer the bottom which could perhaps not be the most enviable of solutions?

[IcePack]

Speaking of, it says clan must be eligible or CDF.
What exactly are those requirements to enter CDF? That really tells us nothing...does a clan merely need to exist w 10 members to enter CDF? What are the requirements?

[Nicky15]

Speaking of, it says clan must be eligible or CDF.
What exactly are those requirements to enter CDF? That really tells us nothing...does a clan merely need to exist w 10 members to enter CDF? What are the requirements?

does it

Apologies that was old wording. Fixed now.

[Vid_FISO]

Speaking of, it says clan must be eligible or CDF.
What exactly are those requirements to enter CDF? That really tells us nothing...does a clan merely need to exist w 10 members to enter CDF? What are the requirements?

does it

Apologies that was old wording. Fixed now.

A bit more copy and paste gone wrong (in organization)

For each clan war, the higher ranked clan will setup a thread to run that particular match. PLEASE PUT "[CC4]" (STANDS FOR CONQUEROR'S CUP 3) AT THE BEGINNING OF THE TITLE FOR EACH CLAN WAR.

[Nicky15]

Speaking of, it says clan must be eligible or CDF.
What exactly are those requirements to enter CDF? That really tells us nothing...does a clan merely need to exist w 10 members to enter CDF? What are the requirements?

does it

Apologies that was old wording. Fixed now.

A bit more copy and paste gone wrong (in organization)

For each clan war, the higher ranked clan will setup a thread to run that particular match. PLEASE PUT "[CC4]" (STANDS FOR CONQUEROR'S CUP 3) AT THE BEGINNING OF THE TITLE FOR EACH CLAN WAR.

Thank you i will fix that now

This is just a holding post. We will start a new thread when everything has been finalized, with One CD as the primary contact

[eddie2]

did you hold a vote in cdf asking if all clans were ok with you dictating that clans who did not want in cdf must join to take part in these clan events now. me personally i dont see why they should have to if they read the sign up thread and are happy to take part then that should be enough. they should not be forced to join a group they do not want to and get involved in convos they do not want to just to make the figures of the group look good.

[jetsetwilly]

There has been much discussion about the format CC4 should take. Lots of people subscribe to the it's always worked well, so why change it approach but others have been equally vocal about their preference for using an alternative system.

There is no right or wrong answer, it's down to you all to decide what you want.

We have attempted to put together a simple list of the options that have come up along the way. There are probably many variations on some of these but if we are to take this to a vote then we need a reasonably short list. A huge list of options might require various elimination votes which is a little onerous on everyone so we hope we can come up with a list here that has a flavour of everything to allow us to take it to a vote.

There is no strong preference from the CD's as a group here. We are fairly certain that amongst our own clans we will be voting for different options.

Let's use this thread just to make sure the options are clear for everyone and the individual clans can discuss their preferred options ahead of the formal vote.



In all cases we are assuming a play in round to get us down to 32 clans. All seeding will be taken from the F400 at the agreed start point.

If more than 32 clans do enter, then we can review the chosen option to see if a play in round was the most appropriate or if the system can be modified to cope with a different number.


1.Seeded bracket system


There are two similar options within option 1 but for the purposes of the initial discussion we propose to keep them as a single option. If this option proves to be the winner then we could determine which of the 2 to go for.

Option 1a uses a strict seeding method for the entire bracket to pair the clans.
Option 1b uses seeding for the top half of the bracket to pair the clans with a randomly drawn opponent.

Option 1a - Seed the entire bracket

Top clans are kept apart for as long as possible using the F400 and you know who are likely to meet as the cup progresses.

Option 1b - Seed the top 16 to play random opponents in round 1

3. Seed the top 16 to play random opponents in round 1 then proceed with a bracket.

The top 16 clans according to the F400 be seeded accordingly, and then you can randomly draw their opponents. Play from there would be from the bracket.

2. An entirely random draw for every round.

For round 1 the 32 teams are pulled from a hat at random
For round 2 the 16 remaining teams are pulled from a hat at random.
etc.

top clans could meet each other in an early round and we might see some big name casualties.

Option 2

3. Alternative system

Clans 1-8 get a bye in Rounds 1 and 2 and join from Round 3
Clans 9-16 get a bye in Round 2 and join in Round 2

There are 2 similar alternatives within option 3 but for the purposes of the initial discussion we propose to keep them as a single option. If this option proves to be the winner then we could determine which of the 2 to go for.

Option 3a uses a random method of pairing the clans. 3b uses a bracket system.

3a:

R1: Clans ranked 17-24 are randomly paired with the clans ranked 25-32
R2: Clans ranked 9-16 are randomly paired with the winners from R1
R3 Clans ranked 1-8 clans are randomly paired with the winers from R2
QF: Remainng clans ranked 1-4 are randomly paired with those ranked 4-8
SF: Remaining clans ranked 1-2 are randomly paried with those ranked 3-4

3b:

R1: Clans ranked 17-24 are paired with the clans ranked 25-32 using the system 17v32; 18v31 ... 24v25
R2: Clans ranked 9-16 are paired with the 8 winners from R1. 9v(24v25); 10v(23v26) ... 16v(17v32)
R3 Clans ranked 1-8 clans are paired with the winners from R2. 1-8. 1v[16v(17v32)]; 2v[15v(18v31)] ... 8v[9v(24v25)]
QF: Remaining 8 clans - 1v8, 2v7, 3v6, 4v5 (or winners of their previous matches)
SF: Remaining 4 clans - 1v4, 2v3 (or winners of their previous matches)

Option 3a

[IcePack]

This makes the vote more complicated, but if possible I would favor a vote where you dont just pick one option, but prioritize all of them.
Such as:
1st Pick = 4 Pts
2nd Pick = 3 pts
3rd pick = 2 pts
4th pick = 1 pt

This way, you can total all clans 4 picks prioritization. That way I can say "i pick option 1, but if i had to choose something else it would be Y, and then X, and then Z."

It would really show the preferances of the clans, instead of limiting to your top option.

[Keefie]

I think that's a great idea from Icepack It will force all clans to actually read and digest the options before casting their votes.

Important Request

So that the questions are as impartial as possible can we please change the wording for option 1. I think it's very important to avoid terms like: as per usual / as used in past Cups / existing format etc etc. Each option should be presented on it's own merits without anything that could influence the voter.

[Crazyirishman]

From the systems that jetsetwilly posted, I personally like the 3rd on 4th options the best.

[IcePack]

How about 3.1:
Random draw round 1, regular bracket onward (not every round).

[Nicky15]

did you hold a vote in cdf asking if all clans were ok with you dictating that clans who did not want in cdf must join to take part in these clan events now. me personally i dont see why they should have to if they read the sign up thread and are happy to take part then that should be enough. they should not be forced to join a group they do not want to and get involved in convos they do not want to just to make the figures of the group look good.

No. Our aim is to try and create a clan world where all clans get a say, and the CDs are not charged with making all the decisions. As much as possible we want clans to be able to decide, and they can't if they are not represented in the CDF. No one is forced to get involved in discussions, and if a clan does not have an opinion on a topic they can abstain their vote. While some may not have an opinion on the way CC4 is organised there may well be an issue that arises mid cup that they will want a say in. Also being a member of CDF means they are a clan with standing enough to make them less likely to pull out mid comp and disrupt the competition. This may well be an non issue as no one apart from yourself has refused to be a member of CDF. AKAs rep is doing his part in the votes we have.

[Doc_Brown]

Now that this is an official Conquer Club event, and given that it was yanked out of Dako's hands with nary a personal message to him of either explanation or thanks for past efforts, I propose that this event be renamed. There is already an official Conquer Cup, and it's just going to be confusing to have the Conquer Cup and the Conqueror's Cup. I suggest this be renamed as the 1st Conquer Club Clan Cup.

[Keefie]

Now that this is an official Conquer Club event, and given that it was yanked out of Dako's hands with nary a personal message to him of either explanation or thanks for past efforts, I propose that this event be renamed. There is already an official Conquer Cup, and it's just going to be confusing to have the Conquer Cup and the Conqueror's Cup. I suggest this be renamed as the 1st Conquer Club Clan Cup.

I'll second that proposal.

[Nicky15]

Now that this is an official Conquer Club event, and given that it was yanked out of Dako's hands with nary a personal message to him of either explanation or thanks for past efforts, I propose that this event be renamed. There is already an official Conquer Cup, and it's just going to be confusing to have the Conquer Cup and the Conqueror's Cup. I suggest this be renamed as the 1st Conquer Club Clan Cup.

That was always the plan for the final thread, but the name will remain, it is the 4th edition of the Conqueror's Cup, but there is no reason why we can't put the official bit in now.

[IcePack]

1CCCC is just annoying lol

[BGtheBrain]

The Lackattack Cup

[Doc_Brown]

1CCCC is just annoying lol

No need to call it CCCC. It's the 1st annual Clan Cup.